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Ultima Any games like Ultima 5

octavius

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I have yet to play a "remake" that captured the original design, feel, and style.

In my opinion you either play a game as it was or not at all.

Bullshit. Sometimes the original game is unplayable for various reasons, like U6 due to the UI, or Marathon due to original being Mac only and the more modern Windows port giving me motion sickness. But the Ultima 6 Project felt very much like an Ultima game to me, and the Unreal Tournament remake of Marathon was very good and so smooth that motion sickness was not a problem. Kudos and my gratitude to the people behind those remakes. Unlike Trench Oyster who gets paid for getting modders to polish old gems, they didn't make any money out of it.
So remakes can be very good, but if you loved the original I guess it can never be good enough.
 

rezaf

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They let your kind of people post on the Codex? :mad:

Beg your pardon? I apologize, the statement wasn't meant to step on anyones toes...

I have yet to play a "remake" that captured the original design, feel, and style.

OpenXCom was/is pretty cool in my book.

I think it boils down to this: From what you've written you won't ever enjoy Ultima V since it isn't your style of game. That is totally okay.

You may be correct, though I have to insist I'm NOT a graphics whore. I recently played a bunch of Rings of Medusa (C64 version), which looks remarkably similar to Ultima IV or thereabouts.
_____
rezaf
 

Deuce Traveler

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Grab the Codex by the pussy Divinity: Original Sin Torment: Tides of Numenera Shadorwun: Hong Kong Pathfinder: Kingmaker Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag. Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture

I found the Ultizurk games to be more akin to Ultimas 1&2 as they are single character CRPGs. So no, I wouldn't compare them to Ultima 4&5. In my personal opinion, I felt that the Exile trilogy felt closest to the Ultima 5 experience, with it's party turn-based combat and various spells. Ultima 5 may have the best turn-based combat system of the Ultima series, though I admit I still have yet to play Ultima 6.

Edit: Also, try the Magic Candle.
 
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MisterStone

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I found the Ultizurk games to be more akin to Ultimas 1&2 as they are single character CRPGs. So no, I wouldn't compare them to Ultima 4&5. In my personal opinion, I felt that the Exile trilogy felt closest to the Ultima 5 experience, with it's party turn-based combat and various spells. Ultima 5 may have the best turn-based combat system of the Ultima series, though I admit I still have yet to play Ultima 6.

I can agree now that the Vogel Exile games are probably the closest thing to u5 since U5... but the writing and adventure gaming/exploration was just not as good. From what I recall these were very mini-quest driven, but lacked the huge macro-quest that characterized Ultima 4 and 5.
 

Sceptic

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Bullshit. Sometimes the original game is unplayable for various reasons, like U6 due to the UI, or Marathon due to original being Mac only and the more modern Windows port giving me motion sickness. But the Ultima 6 Project felt very much like an Ultima game to me
Bullshit yourself. U6 is UI is prefectly fine, never mind that on release it was absolutely groundbreaking. Your getting motion sickness in Marathon is hardly the game's fault. I can't comment on U6P, but I have repeatedly said that Lazarus is not a replacement for U5. When your remake changes the engine, the graphics, the world, the dungeons, the combat, the out-of-combat gameplay, and just about everything, you're not playing a faithful remake with a better UI, you're playing a different game that just happens to share the same story and some of the writing. That I still list Lazarus as a must-play alongside U5 is a testament to how good Lazarus itself is. It's also why I don't agree with your "remakes can never be good enough" - Lazarus is an awesome, awesome game. It's just too different from U5 to replace it. I love both and replay both.

You may be correct, though I have to insist I'm NOT a graphics whore.
Playing the rose-tinted glasses argument, complaining that Lazarus is a turn off because DS engine is ugly, your insistence that one must have played the old games at the time in order to appreciate them...

Ultima 5 may have the best turn-based combat system of the Ultima series, though I admit I still have yet to play Ultima 6.
U5's is better, though personally I'm not a fan of Ultima combat systems in general, and I really don't like 5's. It's waaaaaaaaaaaaaaay too slow and tedious and grindy. Thank god the game isn't combat-focused to begin with, it'd be a nightmare otherwise. I don't think I ever managed to reach level 8 on any of my playthroughs - I get to level 7, notice I've got hours of grinding ahead, and just go to Doom. Doing Doom without the top tier spells is.... interesting.

Edit: Also, try the Magic Candle.
This. MC1 is a fantastic and highly underrated Ultima-lookalike with better combat than Ultima, and almost all encounters are set and handplaced, something quite rare at the time. It's pretty nonlinear, with a quite large world and a LOT of people to talk to - notetaking is required. It's got one of the most original and elaborate endings of any CRPG - you spend the entire game gathering everything you need for a complex ritual, and the endgame is peforming said ritual. It's extremely satisfying. None of the sequels are as good unfortunately, but it's a good series overall - including Bloodstone, which was released last but is a prequel to the series.
 

Melan

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They let your kind of people post on the Codex? :mad:

Beg your pardon? I apologize, the statement wasn't meant to step on anyones toes...
You were given detailed responses about why people liked U5, and you dismissed them by invoking a tired and useless fallacy. Feel free to disagree with people or call them idiots, but don't do that. I would hope that, at least on this site, games would stand on their merits, not their age.
 

octavius

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U6 is UI is prefectly fine, never mind that on release it was absolutely groundbreaking.

Well, what was once cutting edge sometimes ages more badly than the norm. Early 3D graphics was also groundbreaking, but simple 2D graphics have aged better. Of all the many ancient games I've tried the past five years U6 is the only game, together with U7, that I found just unplayable due to the UI.
 

rezaf

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You were given detailed responses about why people liked U5, and you dismissed them by invoking a tired and useless fallacy. Feel free to disagree with people or call them idiots, but don't do that. I would hope that, at least on this site, games would stand on their merits, not their age.

Like I wrote, I wasn't trying to dismiss their opinions - I've been subjected to the same kinds of comments when talking about my beloved classics. But if you people here think my comments were worse than calling them idiots, fair enough, I apologize for the rose colored glasses comment.
I tried to elaborate in that very post, but if that's not enough, I guess my grasp of the english language isn't good enough to get across what I want to say.
_____
rezaf
 
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RPG Wokedex Strap Yourselves In
So I've finally beaten the game. Thanks for all the recommendations, I'll try to remember to brofist everyone in April when I'll actually be able to brofist people. The dungeonering part was significantly weaker than the exploration part. The puzzle were't really that satisfying and usually went down to pushing random and shooting at random walls. What I've liked about it was how you really didn't have to be the most powerful creature in the world to beat it. In fact my party was a bit underleveled, with 7th level avatar, 4 5th level companions and one 3rd level party member. I got through the final room by combination of casting fear spells, abandoning my party and running pretty fast. Nice, considering the fact that most games make sure that you finish them the proper way.
The only thing I've disliked is that the cities lost their flavor because of blackthorne's regime. Yew became just a city with cheap reagents and a prison. It didn't at all fell like a druid's city it was in the first game. Same goes for most of the other cities. The only exception is New Magincia which really was populated by humble peasants like it was supposed to be. Which is strange because the devs didn't really have a city of humility from Ultima IV to base it on.

EDIT:
Now I'm going into Ultima VI. I seriously hope that the cities will go back to what they were supposed to be.
 
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If you want to play the original Ultima 6, use Nuvie (snapshot download) instead of DOSBox. It has a number of improvements that vastly outweigh the minor things that haven't been implemented. Nuvie can load the original save files so you won't lose progress if you already started. The DOS version cannot load the Nuvie save files. Here are a few points.
  • improved UI (and a completely optional popup UI similar to U7 but without the cluttered inventory. The original style (or original+ ones) can use the popup signs and containers. "new" style gets rid of all the always showing UI and does completely with popups.)
  • Added Drag and drop
  • Single click looks at items and npcs on the map (optional)
  • Double click uses the most likely command considering the context
  • Using a door will unlock it if you have the key
  • Allow you to move and use objects more than 1 tile away (optional)
  • expanded game view (optional)
  • smooth lighting instead of dithering (optional). This is recommended when using the larger view area along with the min brightness cheat so that the darkness isn't pitch black.
  • custom graphics by HiPhish so that party members don't look like generic npcs (optional)
  • added roof top tiles in some areas (optional)
  • control the balloon without messing with the wind if you have the magic fan (optional)
  • The tool bar can be toggled to show or not in all styles except "original"
  • There's a conversation gump that allows you to use the mouse (still can use the keyboard) to select keywords. It comes in a solid, dithered, or no background and the background color can be changed. Unfortunately, there are no flags in the PC version to keep track of what keywords should be appear. (keywords in the original message scroll can be clicked too) (optional)

It also allows you to play the superior sfx from the from the FM-Towns version and the awful speech. This thread has the list of files that are needed to transfer. A lot of the game is set up to play as the original so you will need to change things in the menu though for some things you may need to edit the cfg file. Documentation is here. There are a few things added or different in the snapshot. You can download this file and view it in the browser if you really care to look at the updated doc (it will be missing the graphics).


. original 320x200 . . . . . . . original+ 320x200 . . . . . . . new 320x200. . . . . . . . . . . original+ 640x400. . . . . . . original+_full_map 640x400

img]



nuvie_converse_screenshot.png


Edit: Darn you codex editor. Quit adding links.
Edit 2: I thought about the conversation (converse) gump.
Edit 3: Wow, how did forget to add things like I drag and drop, double and single click functions, and the ability to move and use objects more than one tile away. Sorry about the alert spam.
 
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RPG Wokedex Strap Yourselves In
Thanks for being so through with Nuvie. I was going to not use since the save import wasn't implemented, but since it can read DOS save files I can just import it in DOS and continue in Nuvie.
 

Sceptic

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There's a conversation gump that allows you to use the mouse (still can use the keyboard) to select keywords. It comes in a solid, dithered, or no background and the background color can be changed. Unfortunately, there are no flags in the PC version to keep track of what keywords should be appear.
I'm unsure, how does this gump work? Does it list ALL of the keywords that every conversation in the game can accept? Or is it customizable and we can add keywords to it, which are then available in all conversations? The latter would be absolutely awesome, and much better than the game automatically keeping track for you (which if I understand it can't anyway)

It also allows you to play the superior sfx from the from the FM-Towns version and the awful speech.
Welp that does it, next U6 playthrough is with nuvie. The speech might be the most awful to ever grace a video game, but I must experience it at least once. The only reason I never have is that I always import from U5 into U6 and so never played the FM-Towns version past a few minutes of dicking around.

Also, are the Worlds games fully supported now? (Sorry, I'm sure I could find the answer easily but I'm lazy)
 
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The conversation gump only shows the normally highlighted text that comes up in the current conversation. Name, job, bye, join/leave, rune, and mantra are always available unless a shrine or temporary npc. Buy, sell, spells, and reagents don't disappear when you click them due to usually needing to use it multiple times . I remember trading is a little annoying in U6 but would require a lot of manual work to implement another system.

You cannot add custom words to the list at this point unless you edit the code. The original game doesn't have anything keeping track of what to ask unlike the FM-Towns version and Ultima 7 onwards so no automatic tracking. Someone would need to write up every instance, and we would have to find a way to do it without editing the conversation code.

The Worlds of Ultima games still need a lot of work. Eric wants them exact so it is basically only him doing it. I might do some basic "use" command stuff, but I may miss cases. His current code doesn't consider the optional ability to interact with objects more than one tile away, and I wasn't sure how to nicely implement it in the lua code. There isn't any combat code and most schedules haven't been implemented. They are basically slightly interactive map viewers at this point with an intro, character creation, some in game cutscenes, and monster spawning (but not doing anything).

No, U6 is still too fresh in my mind.
Besides I must admit I liked the Dungeon Siege version so much that it will be hard to go "back" to Nuvie.
I figured that you might like to play through it at some point to compare the differences.


Edit: I forgot to mention that conversations work, but there is a chance of game specific conversation commands that don't work.
 
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Sceptic

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The conversation gump only shows the normally highlighted text that comes up in the current conversation. Name, job, bye, join/leave, rune, and mantra are always available unless a shrine or temporary npc.
Oh I see. Might stick to the old system and the usual note taking then.

The original game doesn't have anything keeping track of what to ask unlike the FM-Towns version and Ultima 7
Huh! I don't think I ever realized the FM-Towns version did this, or I just forgot. Interesting.

The Worlds of Ultima games still need a lot of work. Eric wants them exact so it is basically only him doing it. I might do some basic "use" command stuff, but I may miss cases. His current code doesn't consider the optional ability to interact with objects more than one tile away, and I wasn't sure how to nicely implement it in the lua code. There isn't any combat code and most schedules haven't been implemented. They are basically slightly interactive map viewers at this point with an intro, character creation, some in game cutscenes, and monster spawning (but not doing anything).
That's a shame. I love Martian Dreams. I guess there's no reason I can't play U6 with nuvie and the Worlds with DOSBox though.

Thanks for the answers :salute:
 
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The conversation gump only shows the normally highlighted text that comes up in the current conversation. Name, job, bye, join/leave, rune, and mantra are always available unless a shrine or temporary npc.
Oh I see. Might stick to the old system and the usual note taking then.

You can select whether you want to use the gump in the menu so you can try it and change it back without restarting if you don't like it.
 
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Huh! I don't think I ever realized the FM-Towns version did this, or I just forgot. Interesting.

At least, I thought it did that. I saw a bit of a let's play before but have never played that version just used the voices and sfx in Nuvie. You may very well be right. If you are, Nuvie's conversation gump would be pretty much the same as the FM-Towns version in how it works just with different looks.

Edit: I was going to edit my other post but forgot to copy paste the reply.
 
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No, U6 is still too fresh in my mind.
Besides I must admit I liked the Dungeon Siege version so much that it will be hard to go "back" to Nuvie.

That's a shame. I, too, couldn't enjoy U6 because of the terrible UI. But now, with Nuvie, it has quickly become one of my favorite Ultimas. I'm still not sure whether I like it better than U5, but in any way it's excellent.
 

Eggs is eggs

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ULTIMA VI

I played U6 when I was a teen and didn't play U5 until a few years later and I felt like they captured that same sense of adventure, exploration and discovery. The Might and Magic games capture a similar feeling as well. M&M 2,3, 4, 5 6. They all are basically the same game but with better graphics and engine.
 

tibermoon

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I just wandered back to the Codex to see how folks here are feeling about Pillars of Eternity, but lo and behold, I find a new Ultima V thread. It warms my little black heart. :)

If you do end up playing Lazarus, Gangrelrumbler, I'd be curious to hear your thoughts. It isn't for everybody, and it's certainly true that its visuals are showing their age, but I'd like to think it captures the "spirit" of Ultima V quite well.
 
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RPG Wokedex Strap Yourselves In
There actually are druids in Yew, just like they should be so there's a high change I'll enjoy it.
 

pippin

Guest
I think we already had a thread about that game, actually!
 

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