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Age of Wonders 3

  • Thread starter Multi-headed Cow
  • Start date

mastroego

Arcane
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Apr 10, 2013
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Italy
Hi guys, seeking advice from players of this game.
I'm tempted to buy AoW3 during the sale, or go "classic" with AoW: Shadow of Magic.
Huge difference in price obviously but I'm more concerned about the time investment since I have very, VERY little too spare. :(

So the consensus seems to be that they're very fine games despite NOT being quite fine as MoM was. Obviously.
Overall it seems I'd have to stomach the simplified strategic layer: cities are more homogeneous, structures are rather homogeneous as well and so on. I guess the world also misses features like Nightshade, special ores, stuff like that.
BUT, in AoW: SoM some of that can be regained through mods, right?
Which is interesting but at the same time I'm wary of mods that add too much, insert mismatched graphics (disgusting!) in the game and all that.
AoW3 apparently improves on these aspects somewhat thanks to the two large DLCs, but remains inferior to AoW: SoM for instance in magic. Fewer global spells, no strategic level unit enchants (but why?!)...

Am I being accurate?
Which of the two is the funnier and closer experience to MoM? Or perhaps I should avoid both, lest I'd experience, once again, the frustration of not really be playing MoM?
Any comments or suggestions welcome :)
 

The Red Knight

Erudite
Joined
Apr 18, 2017
Messages
485
AoW2:
AoW, and to a lesser degree AoW2 too, have this charm/soul/whatever factor that makes you want to come back to them, imho. Both are heavily leaning towards combat and the simple economy part is about making more units to have said combat.
In both you can make uber heroes but at least in AoW 2 you can just limit the max level to mitigate it. Very pretty maps too (as long as the map maker doesn't ruin that with big, empty, homogenous spaces in the name of balance in case of custom maps).

The best AoW2 mod is the Glorantha one, especially if you get bored with the vanilla game or dislike single-unit units:
http://aow2.heavengames.com/downloads/showfile.php?fileid=781
... with this walls HP patch to make walls and gates sturdier to counter stat changes in units:
http://aow2.heavengames.com/downloads/showfile.php?fileid=841
It replaces all units, changes most of them into army stacks, makes low-tier ones useful, races more unique, shifts balance in regards to some immunities, flying units, some ranged units now lack melee attack, etc. The only ugly part are some of the leader portraits because the author took them from all corners of the internet.
There's also a map pack for it with the converted vanilla maps because it's not compatible with normal AoW2 ones (most intended-for-AoW2 maps you can still just open in the editor and resave, even a few heavily-scripted scenario ones - the not working ones will freeze the map generation/loading after the scenario setup part - but it's easier to just grab the ready archive).
You also can easily add music from AoW1 and KoDP to AoW2.

---
AOW3:
AoW3 lacks soul, has mods adding lots of construction options in cities, more map resources/buildings that add bonuses to the city they're in (Civ-like city ranges) and some units to make it more interesting/varied if you're into that, and disgustingly homogenous indep stacks. There's some (un-)balance mod that messes with many units' stats that makes it more enjoyable imho, though the last time I checked it the author tried to make frostlings lose HP outside of snow terrain and it made that race unplayable (something about them always losing HP each turn and then possibly regenerating the lost part, but it was a death sentence to wounded units and especially the AI had no idea how to keep these units alive).

Leader classes/traits/spell schools limit the customisation options during the game a lot (there are some mods that add merges of existing ones as new traits - you can use these to give yourself thematic-but-weak options and boost the AI by giving it a boss-tier leader), and do weird shit like passively giving most units you control magical attacks (and with a few levels and artifacts you end up giving all your heroes rainbow attacks with a dozen of ranged weapons with cooldowns).

Much less bottlenecking underground in comparison to the previous games because of wider corridors being generated in mapgen and more units having tunneling or rock-passing abilities.

Undead = mostly just a tag on normal units, with related boosts and vulnerabilities (can be a pro or a con depending on if you were expecting a completely separate race of zombies and skeletons), though the economic layer is different if you play as a necromancer (IIRC you need to raise city population with spells, deaths and migration).

Fliers use flying only to move vs being always in air an mostly unreachable to melee units in Aow1/2

The combat itself (sieges included) is still fun if you're not fighting against the copy/paste indie stack #674. AoW1/2 offer more visual clarity though. You should use the option to speed up combat animations (it makes the rainbow damage display unreadble but otherwise you have to suffer through the sluggish eye candy).

You may prefer it if you want to play as a pirate or a conquistador, or can't stand AoW2 looking blurryish nowadays.

In regards to RPG-ish experience, there are quests (including achievement-y empire quest goals that can give you things like a special building option if you reach them first - highest level AI seems good at rushing these btw), vassal towns (the latter is good if you don't want to bother with developing that frontline town that's already guarded by a strong creature), indep monster spawners (unfortunately these indeps are boring as hell and just there to distract or harass players), more unit rank tiers (the level equivalent for non-hero units) and some mods expanding on these and on hero levelups (not sure if fun).
AoW2 has optional shrine quests every now and then (with half of them being cripple-yourself-by-razing-your-structures ones). Both have monster lairs you can explore to gain artifacts, units or resources.

---

Time-wise both can take time to process turns later on when there are more army stacks running around, especially on larger maps, and big battles and sieges will take time to finish. If you don't mind the risk of auto-resolve, you can use it to skip uninteresting/easy-victory battles. The initial phase of spending turns developing towns before they're useful seems to be longer in AoW3 (but maybe my setting preferences are to blame? there are more quick game options there that I've never bothered with).

TL;DR - AoW2 if you want something closer to AoW1 and/or more combat-oriented experience, AoW3 if you want some Civ in your AoW.

AFAIK, neither are quite like MoM (haven't played it yet, unfortunately), so you shouldn't set your expectations too high, though both are good games on their own (even if I can't force myself to play too much of AoW3 in a row).
 

hello friend

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Feb 26, 2012
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I'm on an actual spaceship. No joke.
If you want a MoM-clone Warlock 2 with Renaissance mod is closest you're gonna get, trust me. I kept buying these games looking for the same thing, no other recent game comes close. If you get one of the AoW games it should be to play AoW - fun in it's own right - but a MoM it is not.
 

mastroego

Arcane
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I did a quick search about Warlock 2 and, unless I'm hugely mistaken, it doesn't seem to feature tactical battles...
I'm curious, how can it be close to MoM without tactical maps? Am I missing something?

Thanks for the comments and suggestions guys, keep 'em coming :)
 

mastroego

Arcane
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Italy
Thanks guys, I'll get Warlock 2 + Mod for sure, added to my wishlist.
I'll probably wait for a stronger sale though, since it requires several DLCs and the discount for those is laughable right now.
 
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Matalarata

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The threshold line
Interesting... the first Warlock wasn't a bad game but I remember losing interest quite rapidly, so much that I can't actually remember much of its mechanics. I see Warlock II is even cheaper than the first and has a bigger discount, probably due to the mixed rating.
How about the DLCs are they worth it?



Edit: Dafuq, I decided to buy it and immediately noticed Dominions 5 is out now. MUST-RESIST-THE-URGE-TO-SPEND-ALL-MONIES
 
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mastroego

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Be warned that the consensus seems to be about modded Warlock 2, and the Renaissance mod requires the DLCs.
 

LESS T_T

Arcane
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Codex 2014
Triumph's new game will be announced at PDXCon: http://aow.triumph.net/triumphs-new-game-to-be-announced-may-18th-pdxcon/

TRIUMPH’S NEW GAME TO BE ANNOUNCED MAY 18TH @ PDXCON!

Finally some big news: We will announce our next game during PDXCon in Stockholm on May 18th 2018! Yes, this game is turn-based and yes, this game should appeal to Age of Wonders fans! You can also be there with us at PDXCon, where our parent company Paradox Interactive celebrates the universes and communities of their games.

This large gathering of strategy fans and devs has seminars, contests, LAN sessions, parties and much more. Check here for the details and sign up!Looking forward to seeing you there and showing you all that we’ve been working on for the last two years!
 

octavius

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Bjørgvin
I would have been :bounce: if Triumph was still independent.
But at least they are not serfs owned by EA or ZeniMax, so there's still some hope.
 

Zboj Lamignat

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Messages
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I would have been :bounce: if Triumph was still independent.
But at least they are not serfs owned by EA or ZeniMax, so there's still some hope.
I'm completely out of touch with EA, but Paradox is waaaaay worse than ZeniMax/Beth when it comes to dlc.
 

MilesBeyond

Cipher
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Messages
716
I would have been :bounce: if Triumph was still independent.
But at least they are not serfs owned by EA or ZeniMax, so there's still some hope.
I'm completely out of touch with EA, but Paradox is waaaaay worse than ZeniMax/Beth when it comes to dlc.

I dunno, Paradox seems a lot less obnoxious with DLC when it comes to games they publish. Now, the games they develop, that's a different story...
 

Zboj Lamignat

Arcane
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Messages
5,523
Well, Triumph is owned by Paradox now from what I understand, so it's not like they're only a publisher.
 

MilesBeyond

Cipher
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May 15, 2015
Messages
716
It occurred to me why AoW 3 is a bit divisive. AoW is a fantasy strategy series, and I think AoW 3 is a big step forward as a strategy game, and a big step backwards as a fantasy game. I mean, combat in this game is just orders of magnitude beyond any of the previous installments - any other 4X period, really. The overland empire management is also a fair bit more in depth, and the class system means that every game ends up feeling unique. At the same time, there are less races to explore, less units among the races that are there, and it just in general doesn't feel quite as fun to explore or discover things. There's also a general sense of aesthetic "sameness" - let's take the T1 Archers, for example. Mechanically, there's a huge amount of diversity there, far beyond anything we've seen in previous AoW games. Goblin Darters, Elven Longbowmen, and Halfling Jesters are all radically different units in terms of how they play and how they function - and yet there's still a sense that they feel more same-y than in previous games, and I can't even really put my finger on why. The atmosphere of the game in general feels a little fabricated. AoW 1 felt like a living, breathing fantasy world. AoW SM felt like a strategy game set in a fantasy world. AoW 3 feels like a strategy game. You get what I mean?
 

Silva

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No.

Edit: Though I've only played AoW1 extensively. SM lacked everything I loved in the first, then I gave up on it and never touched the series again.
 
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fantadomat

Arcane
Edgy Vatnik Wumao
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I didn't like AoE 3 because it only had two boring campaigns and it was about industry against magic shit,that i have seen 100 times before and didn't care. For me it didn't have anything in common with the games before AoE 3. It was always about magic for me. Didn't like the Victorian age shit.
 

MilesBeyond

Cipher
Joined
May 15, 2015
Messages
716
No.

Edit: Though I've only played AoW1 extensively. SM lacked everything I loved in the first, then I gave up on it and never touched the series again.

My man. Well, okay, not the giving up and never touching the series again part. I eventually grew to love SM and AoW 3. But the first game just had a magic that nothing else has been able to match.
 

MrBuzzKill

Arcane
Joined
Aug 31, 2013
Messages
650
I also didn't particularly care for the campaign, plot, the setting (even though it tried something new, but not really, as been said before magic vs tech is overused at this point)... Especially after the AoW 1 Cult of Storms (evil) campaign which had SO many highlights for me, that I was anxious to get through every mission just to get to the next bit of the protagonist's story
Spoiler:
end_Highmen_C_1.png

end_Highmen_C_2.png
 

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