Putting the 'role' back in role-playing games since 2002.
Donate to Codex
Good Old Games
  • Welcome to rpgcodex.net, a site dedicated to discussing computer based role-playing games in a free and open fashion. We're less strict than other forums, but please refer to the rules.

    "This message is awaiting moderator approval": All new users must pass through our moderation queue before they will be able to post normally. Until your account has "passed" your posts will only be visible to yourself (and moderators) until they are approved. Give us a week to get around to approving / deleting / ignoring your mundane opinion on crap before hassling us about it. Once you have passed the moderation period (think of it as a test), you will be able to post normally, just like all the other retards.

Eternity Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pre-DLC Thread [GO TO NEW THREAD]

Infinitron

I post news
Staff Member
Joined
Jan 28, 2011
Messages
97,228
Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
Would be better to talk about how it actually plays in the game than how it looks like in the patch notes. :M
 
Vatnik
Joined
Apr 10, 2018
Messages
6,703
Location
Mouse Utopia
Insert Title Here Strap Yourselves In
It reads like a dota update.

careful

someone's gonna come here and say that's good
If only it read like DotA patchnotes, I love reading those and DotA2 has high impact items with big actives like spell immunity, invisibility, AoE stun etc. This reads like how I imagine League patchnotes to be, where every item is a pathetic +3% modifier stat stick and hero abilities are a bunch of minute fiddly calculations

Hopefully the DLCs will reintroduce some cool items on par with Abydon's Hammer. So far PoE2 seems lacking in cool items. Off the top of my head I can only recall frostseeker, the +3 CON belts, the Reforge the Flesh belt, Eder's armour, Xoti' lantern with the aura, and not much else.
 

Dwarvophile

Liturgist
Joined
Dec 1, 2015
Messages
1,427
Josh is again mistaking "unremarkable" for "balanced" I see.

And here we are, back to the insignificant magic items. The legendary weaponss with +3% something bonus. This only thing special about those is that they have a name and a background.
This is something that really bored me in the First, maybe more than DOS2 itemization.

I mean basically the mariner's porridge gives you more power than your most powerfull weapon. Why not start wit hnerfing food and pets.

Oh well...
 

Infinitron

I post news
Staff Member
Joined
Jan 28, 2011
Messages
97,228
Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
I think the bonuses that are now +3% were +5% before, not exactly an eye-popping number either.

The reason I'm somewhat skeptical about how bad this is is because the effects of the items are still the same. I thought that was what mainly bothered people about the items in PoE1 - what they do, not what the exact numbers are.
 

Sizzle

Arcane
Joined
Feb 17, 2012
Messages
2,471
Interesting - a lot of PoE1's items got a significant buff in v2, but here it's the other way 'round.
 
Self-Ejected

aweigh

Self-Ejected
Joined
Aug 23, 2005
Messages
17,978
Location
Florida
people whinge over everything. like anyone is really going to notice 10% less or more in whatever random item.
 

Wunderbar

Arcane
Joined
Nov 15, 2015
Messages
8,809
SQLZBVX.png
Ac893mC.png
 

IHaveHugeNick

Arcane
Joined
Apr 5, 2015
Messages
1,870,123
You guys seem to forget that unlike in the first game, everything is stacking now. So those tiny bonuses can still add up to a massive difference, whereas in the first game you had +2 from one item slot and that's it.
 

FreeKaner

Prophet of the Dumpsterfire
Joined
Mar 28, 2015
Messages
6,908
Location
Devlet-i ʿAlīye-i ʿErdogānīye
Players were too powerful, I don't understand why people are upset about item nerfs. I guess it's a mistake to overtune stuff at release because regardless if an item is broken or not people will not like it. Best is to release everything undertuned and increase until you find sweet spot.

On the other hand, game is fucking hard now. I might save my POTD run for after DLCs.
 

yes plz

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Jul 14, 2008
Messages
2,158
Pathfinder: Wrath
Were there any consequences in Deadfire related to Thaos' fate? I destroyed his soul, so I'm assuming I missed whatever was related to him.
 

Quillon

Arcane
Joined
Dec 15, 2016
Messages
5,214
Were there any consequences in Deadfire related to Thaos' fate? I destroyed his soul, so I'm assuming I missed whatever was related to him.

Apparently it was the "benevolent" choice, we gave him peace by utterly destroying his soul.
 

Shadenuat

Arcane
Joined
Dec 9, 2011
Messages
11,955
Location
Russia
You guys seem to forget that unlike in the first game, everything is stacking now. So those tiny bonuses can still add up to a massive difference, whereas in the first game you had +2 from one item slot and that's it.
no we don't

when you use something like flames of devotion and end up hitting enemy for extra 0.3 damage, you quickly realise that auto attacking & healing might win some fights just as well
 

Shadenuat

Arcane
Joined
Dec 9, 2011
Messages
11,955
Location
Russia
Vion-ceth
  • Wood Splitter +30% Damage vs Plants -> +20%.
  • Feller +45% Damage vs Plants -> +20%.
  • Grove Step 50% Health Condition -> 75%
  • Wood Bane +100% Damage vs Plants -> + 30%.

    Did anyone even USE this item? :lol: Holy fuck

It now does extra damage against enemies under Plant effect. So say you cast Entangle on enemies, they get extra damage from the hatchet.

Still not worth using compared to supah pen speed crit sabres but the idea is good. The numbers are too low though to bother of course, but idea itself is decent.
 
Self-Ejected

MajorMace

Self-Ejected
Patron
Joined
May 6, 2018
Messages
2,008
Location
Souffrance, Franka
"Game is too easy but still let us one shot mobs without effort" seems like a such a silly complain.
Now you'll two-shot them without effort, rejoice.
Actually no, you won't because the actual fix has been delivered as well : give enemies actual means to make the PC lose health, which was non existent before that, in addition to extra AR and probably HP bloat.

Which makes this long list of minute changes perfectly pointless mechanically. The only purpose, which Sawyer actually talked about at some point with his New Vegas gun sound anecdote, is to give the impression that everything's gonna change and play completely differently.
It won't, it'll just take more time to kill things.
Then again, the actual fix (or attempt, at least, time will tell) has been delivered as well, so who cares hey ?
The only situation which benefits from autistically revising every pc ability and item (for no other reason, really) occurs when you fight vampires. But then again, all you had to do was modify the vampire's domination to make it apply a damage reduction on the target, and save yourself a lot of time and pointless tuning.
 

Shadenuat

Arcane
Joined
Dec 9, 2011
Messages
11,955
Location
Russia
Holy fuck I just got absolutely destroyed in the ruins. POTD looks like it's mandatory optimised custom party.
I'd say the only must have is chanter because infinite summon is simply too useful. With it you can easily split the mobs. Also some of summons are absolutely broken.

For example, 2 ogres have a sum of 700 hp. You think that's already good, but wait - they have 2 infinite abilities. One does extra damage on enemies under some effect, while another is heavy drinking. What does drinking do? Well, it gives ogres... Superstronk+Robust. So +2 pen, +2 armor, +regeneration, +damage and HP. Throw an extra heal, and not only they're infinite, when they're summoned they basically can't be killed. Oops.
 

FreeKaner

Prophet of the Dumpsterfire
Joined
Mar 28, 2015
Messages
6,908
Location
Devlet-i ʿAlīye-i ʿErdogānīye
Now you'll two-shot them without effort, rejoice.
Actually no, you won't because the actual fix has been delivered as well : give enemies actual means to make the PC lose health, which was non existent before that, in addition to extra AR and probably HP bloat.

Which makes this long list of minute changes perfectly pointless mechanically. The only purpose, which Sawyer actually talked about at some point with his New Vegas gun sound anecdote, is to give the impression that everything's gonna change and play completely differently.
It won't, it'll just take more time to kill things.
Then again, the actual fix (or attempt, at least, time will tell) has been delivered as well, so who cares hey ?
The only situation which benefits from autistically revising every pc ability and item (for no other reason, really) occurs when you fight vampires. But then again, all you had to do was modify the vampire's domination to make it apply a damage reduction on the target, and save yourself a lot of time and pointless tuning.

Player's power does not exist in a vacuum against the enemies. So many things were overtuned it made the game trivial, especially once items and passives started stacking up. Abilities still are impactful but not every single ability player has is an "I win" button now. Also yes there is a big difference between one-shotting and two-shotting enemies. It means you can't alpha-strike your most powerful ability through all encounters now and have to also anticipate defences.

Maybe some item nerfs are over done I cannot comment on that, but "never touch the player power only the enemy power" is not something that's either agreeable or reasonable. It takes 1.0 as a basis of absolute truth of what the player power should be for no reason at all, it's obvious for anyone who followed beta Sawyer thought the game might be a little too hard and overtuned items and especially active abilities.
 

FreeKaner

Prophet of the Dumpsterfire
Joined
Mar 28, 2015
Messages
6,908
Location
Devlet-i ʿAlīye-i ʿErdogānīye
I'd say the only must have is chanter because infinite summon is simply too useful. With it you can easily split the mobs. Also some of summons are absolutely broken.

For example, 2 ogres have a sum of 700 hp. You think that's already good, but wait - they have 2 infinite abilities. One does extra damage on enemies under some effect, while another is heavy drinking. What does drinking do? Well, it gives ogres... Superstronk+Robust. So +2 pen, +2 armor, +regeneration, +damage and HP. Throw an extra heal, and not only they're infinite, when they're summoned they basically can't be killed. Oops.

People then think this shouldn't be touched because "Why take away our power?". Is this really the game you want to play?
 

jaydee2k

Savant
Joined
Nov 3, 2016
Messages
449
He's responsible for all the major narrative design decisions. Pallegina is terrible, but that's a minor issue. The plot, companions, and companion quests were the main blunders. And MCA didn't say the Cain/Boyarsky project had the same structure, only that the partners thought it had the same issues. Even if it does have the same structure and problems, I don't see how that makes PoE2's shortcomings any better.

To clarify as best I can: I believe was that Indiana was accused of having potential story problems by the owners (or the owners called the meeting based on another’s opinion of Indiana).

The problem was that PoE2’s storyline had the exact same issues that were being raised against Indiana and apparently PoE2 did not get the same sort of intervention (the similarity to PoE2 doesn’t sound like it was part of the meeting, but something that became apparent when the specific objections were raised as they were present in PoE2's story). I wasn’t at the meeting, obviously, but I’d be doubtful on any negative story critique of Indiana based on what I’ve read of Leonard’s designs and work before/after on other projects. I’m sure either Josh or Leonard could speak to this if asked.

I don’t know what the issues were, only that it felt like a double-standard was in place (or if PoE2 had gotten an intervention, it didn't seem like anything had changed).

Personally, I am still confused who did what on PoE2, story-wise – I was curious who wrote the story (which is why I asked a few times). As far as I could tell, Carrie’s co-lead (?) title felt like it was announced late, which further confused me, as I don’t think that was her title at the start of the game – but again, I have no idea. I imagine Josh could answer the divisions and responsibilities if asked – or if someone has a quote, feel free to share it. I'd love narrative breakdowns for sure.

The most I know is that I believe Josh had said that the choices of returning companions weren't his (possibly to deflect from Pallegina and favoritism, even though she has ties to the setting of PoE2, so it does make sense she’d be there and slightly odd if she wasn’t), and I think he cited Carrie and Eric as having suggested Aloth, Eder, and Pallegina. I’m sure it’s in a podcast interview somewhere. If I'm wrong, happy to be proven wrong.

But back to the clarification with the story elements: Part of my point with the story intervention was that Pillars and the higher-level devs on Pillars often got a pass on certain elements, including procedures like project “check-ins” (team would provide a progress report on the game to the owners, although those often got canceled, delayed, etc. which didn’t instill much faith in them) – however, Pillars would often ignore them while I was there.

Now, projects that did do these presentations arguably got damaged and lost time and resources for following the “procedure” vs. projects that didn’t have the same level of scrutiny or exposure (this isn’t anything new in my experience, but the problem is the double-standard – you’re actually punishing teams for doing what you want and indirectly rewarding those that don’t who ignore the things you ask for). I didn’t have this issue on Tyranny, only because I wasn’t on Tyranny for most of these check-ins. Anyway. Hope this helps.

Deadfire is better than any of your mind-farts ever been and now suck it salty.
 

Shadenuat

Arcane
Joined
Dec 9, 2011
Messages
11,955
Location
Russia
I think you're kinda missing the point.

There's an axe against plants that got -70% damage against plants, and there's chanter with infinite summons against whom enemy doesn't have anything like death spell, dispell and is not smart to use interrupt while chanter does his 6+ seconds cast (because Chanter is not lowest HP member is group) that is still ok.

I think the bonuses that are now +3% were +5% before, not exactly an eye-popping number either.

The reason I'm somewhat skeptical about how bad this is is because the effects of the items are still the same. I thought that was what mainly bothered people about the items in PoE1 - what they do, not what the exact numbers are.
Double damage against dragons or +3 damage against dragons. Effects are still numbers. They use numbers.
 
Last edited:

As an Amazon Associate, rpgcodex.net earns from qualifying purchases.
Back
Top Bottom