KickStarter Queen's Wish: The Conqueror - the Jeff Vogel Kickstarter

[frajaq]

I don't think this RPG looks very good!

 

[dragonul09]

But with only a little more work he could make lots of more money.

Dont you dare questioning the living legend, you know that he's very popular, almost as popular as the turd I took this morning

 

[Elwro]

I don't understand all this negativity... if he succesfully kickstarts the game with such a lousy video, more power to him

And I don't think any of us really know he would make more money by changing the pitch. He might alienate his old customers and not bring enough new ones.

I also think he is actually managing to attract people who pirated his games before -- see the comments.

 

[fantadomat]

But with only a little more work he could make lots of more money.

You could become his apprentice. In a few years you will begin calling yourself a legendary apprentice!

 

[Pope Amole II]

I'm not even surprised that this looks even shittier than his current games. And it'll probably play the same way too. Honestly, just fuck this burnout. Whatever he was, he just isn't anymore.

 

[Drowed]

How come he's asking money for a game that looks way uglier than ever? I mean, does he invest in "artists" to make the game look even uglier?

 

[fantadomat]

The popamole crowd is strong in here....sadly.

 

[Deuce Traveler]

The meat of the game seems to be here:

Explore an enormous outdoors and search for towns and dungeons. Fight clever, carefully designed turn-based battles. Meet three different fierce nations, and deal with them with cunning, diplomacy, or (if you choose) violence.

Build new forts and customize them. Install your own smithies, shops, and furniture, giving each fortress your own unique spin. Choose how to expand your towns. The sorts of shops you specialize in will give your character different bonuses.

It sounds interesting. Kind of like an Exile/Avernum exploration game where you also do some kingdom management, like the old tabletop Companion-level green box in BECMI D&D or the more recent Pathfinder: Kingmaker adventure path. I'm in, and hoping its more like Avernum than Avadon.

 

[agris]

And I don't think any of us really know he would make more money by changing the pitch. He might alienate his old customers and not bring enough new ones.

How do you reason that a bulleted list of features, or a more deliberate, concise introduction to him and his games, more information about what he's done prior, and a general improvement in presentation formatting would alienate his old customers? Has he captured the little known "aversion to quality" market segment? Your post reads like apologism masquerading as an argument pretending to invoke a logic that I don't follow.

 

[*-*/\--/\~]

Takes some gall to introduce yourself as a living legend. :D Sadly, the last Spiderweb games I enjoyed were Avernum 3 and Blades of Avernum, whatever came after he 'modernized' (geneforgized? ;d) the engine was kinda meh. Plus Avadon was shit.

 

[ghostdog]

Did he use the non-isometric view to sell the illusion that he's not using the exact same engine and assets from his 5 previous games?

Because not only it's not working, It looks a lot worse.

 

[Mustawd]

How come he's asking money for a game that looks way uglier than ever? I mean, does he invest in "artists" to make the game look even uglier?

The issue with what he posted in the video is that it conpletely lacks any art direction whatsoever. In addition, he has at least more than one artist working on making assets, so I imagine there’s going to be a lack of continuity just by that fact since I’m guessing Vogel doesn’t know shit about creating a consistent art style.

IMO he should have either:

A. Kept his old artist as at least that guy seemed to be a bit more competent in keeping a consistent art direction

B. Just hire a decent pixel artist and make a better version of Exile graphics. The old walking animations of the old games were a lil goofy, but these new ones are godawful. He would be better off just moving the icons around with no animation. Like a rougelike for example.

 

[Mustawd]

Did he use the non-isometric view to sell the illusion that he's not using the exact same engine and assets from his 5 previous games?

I’m guessing he’s using the non isometric version because coding is likely easier. Not only on PC but also mobile devices and ipads.

But he’s reusing the portraits from Avernum? I mean cmon. This whole thing is a hot mess. I just hope it’s easily moddable so someone sane can replace these eyesores.

 

[V_K]

I’m guessing he’s using the non isometric version because coding is likely easier. Not only on PC but also mobile devices and ipads.

Even in a top-down perspective he could have something looking like LoX:

(made on a similar budget to what he's asking too).
But honestly, if he wants to do top-down and is tight on money, he should've just used default RPGMaker assets - they'd be a huge improvement over the art he has.

 

[Elwro]

So, I finally realised what this new 'style' reminds me of:

It's some game called 'Stardew Valley' -- anyone here played it? Do you think it might be an influence?

Frankly, I have no idea why he changed his old engine, which at least gave everything a consistent look, to something like this what we see in the video...

 

[mondblut]

Finally bothered to click through the video. Screenshots don't look particularly terrible. Despite the perspective, it surprisingly doesn't give the "imma dumb nintentard jrpg for and about 8 year olds" vibe. Looks better than his crudely hacked together lego isometry for sure.

Isometry is overrated anyway, topdown is far more convenient.

 

[Elwro]

So guys, how about a fundraiser so that the Codex can put an item / character / quest into a Vogel game? Discussing it with him will surely be fun

 

[mondblut]

So guys, how about a fundraiser so that the Codex can put an item / character / quest into a Vogel game? Discussing it with him will surely be fun

I propose several iterations of the same item, each worse but fancier looking (yet simultaneously uglier) than the previous.

 

[Elwro]

Or a quest chain, helping an artist who keeps painting the same piece even though he wants to paint something else . He always asks for some ingredients. It''s a simple fetch quest and the game randomises the identity and location of the stuff. But if you complete the quest you just get it again and again. So a player can just keep doing the same quest with minimal changes. But there is a way of breaking the chain and making the artist move on, and that is...

....here I will let the great Codex hivemind do its magic !

 

[fantadomat]

But there is a way of breaking the chain and making the artist move on, and that is...

To lead a revolution and become a conquering artist!

 

[thesheeep]

This legit feels like a kickstarter campaign from six years ago, before anyone knew how to kickstart.

I agree.

However, in contrast to the KS devs of the early days, this one has proven again and again that he can develop a game on a small budget.
Despite the lackluster KS pitch, does anyone doubt he'll develop the game he pitches? I don't.

What surprises me, though, is the "new engine".
Just looks like the old one with higher resolution everything. Not that I mind, but I thought it would be a bigger deal.

However, the game itself just sounds "meh".
The best thing about all his other games to me has been the combat and lack of useless fluff.

Now, there will be "town building". Ugh. And because it won't be the center of the game, it will be pretty damn basic and uninteresting. Just like crafting, I wish such features would just be left out to focus on making the core better.
I was pretty sure I was going to back the KS, but I think I'll pass on this one.

 

[LESS T_T]

Vogel didn't bother, so I've captured some:

Somehow this reminds me of RPG Maker's medieval asset series:

Spoiler

(To be fair these are polished paid assets, usually $10 per set.)

 

[MRY]

Art definitely reminds me of some games from the 1990s, but I'm having a hard time putting my finger on them. Might've been something made in the VERGE engine, might have been Dink Smallwood.

"Queen Sharoyn" is the best name he's had since the enemy General Limoncello in Exile 2 (was that where he appeared?). I remember back in the days of the BIS boards, some dude was making a game where the best weapon was called Cilantro the Singing Sword; same generally caliber of nomenclature.

The knocks on him calling himself a "living legend" are totally unfair. He has an obvious self-effacing twinkle in his eye when he says that. I was surprised at what an old guy he is -- kind of a Last Jedi vibe to him.

Overall, notwithstanding the thinness of the pitch, I'm pretty optimistic. I think Vogel's best knack is creating these really detailed and interconnected environments, and that would actually, I think, lend itself well to the city-building aspect of this.

 

[Werdna's Revenge]

Fuck it, I've decided to back him. At the very least I feel like I can trust him to deliver. Most kickstarters don't have his track record.

 

[Tigranes]

I don't mind the graphics, or the superlazy pitch, but...

Vogel's been making pretty much exactly these games for 25 years. And it doesn't really seem like his best games are yet to come; on the contrary, it seems pretty sure that his new games will sit pretty safe in the middle of his portfolio.

So... why should I suddenly pay up front to support that? Because he'll stop otherwise? Do we really need 15 Vogel games, especially if the best ones have probably been made already? I would expect some kind of ambitious gameplay addition, the idea that we'd finally get a Vogel game he wanted to make all this time. Instead we have a 'new engine' and a guy who stares uncannily to the off-centre of the camera.