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Eternity Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pre-DLC Thread [GO TO NEW THREAD]

fantadomat

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19g4nquneiybpjpg.jpg

dragonfall-is-the-shadowrun-i-know-and-love-1525636558
Well written women!
Dragonfall has good writing and characters, yes.
If you can filter out all the propaganda about the pay gap, discrimination of women in the workplace and rape culture, Eiger is actually a pretty well written character. In fact, I agree with Kit Walker - I think characterisation wasn't too bad in Dragonfall. Though, obviously, you have to play the next game in the series to meet Harebrained's best character.
Hmmm i am pretty touchy when it comes to sjw shit,but never felt that there was that much in her. I don't even remember what is her comment on the wage gap. Breaking the nose of some dude made sense in this situation. Army is like prison,you have to show that you are not to be fucked early on. What i found SJW was the "racist" compound,it was really shit and i was rolling my eyes constantly. That is why i always let the guy run away.
 

fantadomat

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Demonic possession is stupid, yes, it continues her cycle of abuse and robs her of agency and influence.
No,it is not. It is one of the highlights of the game,we are talking about the shadowrun world,a place where magic combines with modern society. Is it that strange to you that the devil could come up and fuck up people? Or is it just a butthurt atheism?

Anyway i do agree with you on the rest. Glory is pretty good character and have interesting story....like all the rest. It is surprising that people here are offended at the edginess of the characters. The are perfectly put in their place,normal wage slaves don't become a shadowrunners just because.
 

Lacrymas

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Pathfinder: Wrath
No,it is not. It is one of the highlights of the game,we are talking about the shadowrun world,a place where magic combines with modern society. Is it that strange to you that the devil could come up and fuck up people? Or is it just a butthurt atheism?
It robs her of choices, character development and agency. Instead of her abuse leading her to lash out against the people who love her, it's some mind control or demonic possession doing it, which cheapens it.
 

FreeKaner

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It robs her of choices, character development and agency. Instead of her abuse leading her to lash out against the people who love her, it's some mind control or demonic possession doing it, which cheapens it.

I thought it was great for showing the fantastic spiral down, from a teenager who hated her parents due abuse to becoming part of a grooming gang all the way into demonic possession. It's a nice shadowrun take on the real world cycle of abuse and derailing of lives.

She didn't join the gang because of demonic possession, the demonic possession was the culmination and conclusion.
 

Trashos

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Can someone tell me why Californians are so gay and sjw?

What's wrong with that part of Usa?

California is full of young people who don't know shit about life yet but want to change the world anyway. I consider it to be like one of those vault social experiments.
 

Vityaz

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What i found SJW was the "racist" compound,it was really shit and i was rolling my eyes constantly. That is why i always let the guy run away.

To be fair, Humanis (the racist anti-metahuman faction) was already conceived years ago in the original tabletop Shadowrun so eh, its inclusion does not bother me that much. Nor does it feel that much out of place.

Also yeah, Glory is a pretty good character. I agree.
 

Lacrymas

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Pathfinder: Wrath
She didn't join the gang because of demonic possession, the demonic possession was the culmination and conclusion.

The culmination was her killing her mom, but that only came about due to the demonic possession, as opposed to everything else leading her to mistake her mother for her father due to impatience or bloodlust. The Adversary knew that her mom would open the door and that's why it urged her to unleash her power then.
 

Sizzle

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Demonic possession is stupid, yes, it continues her cycle of abuse and robs her of agency and influence.
No,it is not. It is one of the highlights of the game,we are talking about the shadowrun world,a place where magic combines with modern society. Is it that strange to you that the devil could come up and fuck up people? Or is it just a butthurt atheism?

It's not about atheism or anything like that, but about one simple question - does making her be possessed by the devil or being an abuse victim make her a better character?

All too often, video game writers (and not just them, unfortunately) confuse character traits with having actual character. They start with one (or more) fantastical element(s), which they then blow out of proportion - instead of fleshing out the characters themselves - until that is all that's left.

Which is, I feel, what happened with Glory. They had a good idea for a compelling character, which they pushed to the point of predictable cliche. Toning her down a bit would have been far more interesting.
 

norolim

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Hmmm i am pretty touchy when it comes to sjw shit,but never felt that there was that much in her. I don't even remember what is her comment on the wage gap.
She probably didn't make any comments on the wage gap specifically. I just added it to the list in an effort to exaggerate. But I think the other two are valid. I don't remember the dialogues well enough to talk about specifics, but I clearly recall there was some sexism and rape talk, when she was recounting her military experiences. It read like something they felt obliged to put in there, because of ideology. I certainly thought the character could do without this kind of shit. She would be a better character, if they wrote proper motivations for her, instead of what current propaganda dictated. But that's just my impression. If you felt those motifs were justified, that's fine.
 

fantadomat

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No,it is not. It is one of the highlights of the game,we are talking about the shadowrun world,a place where magic combines with modern society. Is it that strange to you that the devil could come up and fuck up people? Or is it just a butthurt atheism?
It robs her of choices, character development and agency. Instead of her abuse leading her to lash out against the people who love her, it's some mind control or demonic possession doing it, which cheapens it.
Well it was a choice,everything that led to it was a choice. In the end her choices ended up paying her with a big "Fuck you bitch!".

What i found SJW was the "racist" compound,it was really shit and i was rolling my eyes constantly. That is why i always let the guy run away.

To be fair, Humanis (the racist anti-metahuman faction) was already conceived years ago in the original tabletop Shadowrun so eh, its inclusion does not bother me that much. Nor does it feel that much out of place.

Also yeah, Glory is a pretty good character. I agree.
I don't have problem with humanists,it is pretty logical group that will be created in such scenario. My problem is with how forced SJW the writing was. For all they knew i could have been one of those bastards.

Demonic possession is stupid, yes, it continues her cycle of abuse and robs her of agency and influence.
No,it is not. It is one of the highlights of the game,we are talking about the shadowrun world,a place where magic combines with modern society. Is it that strange to you that the devil could come up and fuck up people? Or is it just a butthurt atheism?

It's not about atheism or anything like that, but about one simple question - does making her be possessed by the devil or being an abuse victim make her a better character?

All too often, video game writers (and not just them, unfortunately) confuse character traits with having actual character. They start with one (or more) fantastical element(s), which they then blow out of proportion - instead of fleshing out the characters themselves - until that is all that's left.

Which is, I feel, what happened with Glory. They had a good idea for a compelling character, which they pushed to the point of predictable cliche. Toning her down a bit would have been far more interesting.
Don't really know mate. I just liked her more than all of PoE characters. We still remember her story,right? Sooo the writing must have done something right to be remembered while 80% of PoE characters are forgotten. Deadfire is even worst,the characters there don't even have story outside of wanting to fuck you.
 

FreeKaner

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She didn't join the gang because of demonic possession, the demonic possession was the culmination and conclusion.

The culmination was her killing her mom, but that only came about due to the demonic possession, as opposed to everything else leading her to mistake her mother for her father due to impatience or bloodlust. The Adversary knew that her mom would open the door and that's why it urged her to unleash her power then.

Demonic possession lead to that, but it's the punctuation. The culmination is her life derailing to the point that she has became vulnerable to getting possessed. She had agency and personality, and that lead to her quite literally losing control of her own life.

It's not about atheism or anything like that, but about one simple question - does making her be possessed by the devil or being an abuse victim make her a better character?

All too often, video game writers (and not just them, unfortunately) confuse character traits with having actual character. They start with one (or more) fantastical element(s), which they then blow out of proportion - instead of fleshing out the characters themselves - until that is all that's left.

Which is, I feel, what happened with Glory. They had a good idea for a compelling character, which they pushed to the point of predictable cliche. Toning her down a bit would have been far more interesting.

No, glory stands on her own as a character even with her past. Also yes, people of intricate and unusual upbringings can be better characters exactly because they are more complex. In a world of fantasy and cyberpunk, it's a thematic and fitting twist to the spiral to streets that is possible in regular world.
 

fantadomat

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Hmmm i am pretty touchy when it comes to sjw shit,but never felt that there was that much in her. I don't even remember what is her comment on the wage gap.
She probably didn't make any comments on the wage gap specifically. I just added it to the list in an effort to exaggerate. But I think the other two are valid. I don't remember the dialogues well enough to talk about specifics, but I clearly recall there was some sexism and rape talk, when she was recounting her military experiences. It read like something they felt obliged to put in there, because of ideology. I certainly thought the character could do without this kind of shit. She would be a better character, if they wrote proper motivations for her, instead of what current propaganda dictated. But that's just my impression. If you felt those motifs were justified, that's fine.
It never felt that way to me. It make perfect sense,it was not about raping,it was about some guy making passes/sex jokes at her and she break his nose. For a woman working as a front-line merc,she needs to be a tough bitch. People do rape people is fucked up situation mate,especially during war.
 

Lacrymas

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Pathfinder: Wrath
The Adversary doesn't incite her to violence, it incites her to inflict suffering in such a way as to torture herself as well. That's why it tricked her into killing her mom. The culmination has to be killing her mom because something else happens after it, i.e. she snapping out of it and severing her connection to magic. A culmination is a turning point and the lowest a character goes to (in this context) before something different happens, a change in trajectory.
 

fantadomat

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The Adversary doesn't incite her to violence, it incites her to inflict suffering in such a way as to torture herself as well. That's why it tricked her into killing her mom. The culmination has to be killing her mom because something else happens after it, i.e. she snapping out of it and severing her connection to magic. A culmination is a turning point and the lowest a character goes to (in this context) before something different happens, a change in trajectory.

There is no demonic "possession".

True, I misremembered. There was no possession, it was only Adversary inciting her to further violence. That's even better.

It was more of a loosing control in the moment. As all the shamans could do in the world. Also Lacrymas,what is the problem with the devil loving irony? I don't get what you don't like about the situation? Is it the lack of choice? That is pretty human,some people continuesly do dumb shit until they are fucked beyond any help.
 

Lacrymas

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Pathfinder: Wrath
It was more of a loosing control in the moment. As all the shamans could do in the world. Also Lacrymas,what is the problem with the devil loving irony? I don't get what you don't like about the situation? Is it the lack of choice? That is pretty human,some people continuesly do dumb shit until they are fucked beyond any help.

It negates the logical conclusion of her choices and character, relegating it to mind control or trickery. Falling into the clutches of the devil can be a culmination and a valid one, but in her case it's just another stepping stone down her spiral. Being tricked also absolves her of moral guilt or responsibility, the writers can have their cake and eat it too by sidestepping the moral issue and presenting her as the victim in this case. Which is cheap and loses a dimension.
 

Rinslin Merwind

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Hmmm i am pretty touchy when it comes to sjw shit,but never felt that there was that much in her. I don't even remember what is her comment on the wage gap. Breaking the nose of some dude made sense in this situation. Army is like prison,you have to show that you are not to be fucked early on. What i found SJW was the "racist" compound,it was really shit and i was rolling my eyes constantly. That is why i always let the guy run away.
Army is like prison,you have to show that you are not to be fucked early on.
Only in Eastern Europe, especially in Russia, where government not take their citizens & soldiers as humans - without any care or respect. I mean they take passport from soldiers during servitude (in fact stripping them from their citizenship), so any violence and torture against their own soldiers can be done without any consequences. It's kinda sad and ironic that you find such situation as some kind of norm in REAL life, while going all "pretty touchy when it comes to sjw shit" in COMPUTER game.

P.S.Well, I guess all people have their priorities. For someone reference of writer's political believes on another side of our planet is more important, than government's bad treatment of their own soldiers (you know, people who was respected during long history of mankind) on their side of our planet.
 
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fantadomat

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It was more of a loosing control in the moment. As all the shamans could do in the world. Also Lacrymas,what is the problem with the devil loving irony? I don't get what you don't like about the situation? Is it the lack of choice? That is pretty human,some people continuesly do dumb shit until they are fucked beyond any help.

It negates the logical conclusion of her choices and character, relegating it to mind control or trickery. Falling into the clutches of the devil can be a culmination and a valid one, but in her case it's just another stepping stone down her spiral. Being tricked also absolves her of moral guilt or responsibility, the writers can have their cake and eat it too by sidestepping the moral issue and presenting her as the victim in this case. Which is cheap and loses a dimension.
You really have strange way of looking at thing Lacrymas. From my point of view,it is about getting what she deserved it a way. Being a bad guy,then someone killing you mother doesn't clean the slate. Both you(the player ) and Glory said that she is not redeemable that easy. She did accept responsibility for the killing and you as the player get the option to agree with her. Also kudos for the well written devil,he was he was true to the epithet "lord of lies". The moment is a moment of condemnation and punishment in a way. It represents the moment where you loose control of your life,and the mess comes down like an avalanche. Most certainly is not about redemption,maybe a second chance.

We are all victims to our own life and the choices we made. You could be both the victim and the perpetrator.
 
Self-Ejected

MajorMace

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roxor compares poe1 at release, just so you know
which was indeed way easier, you'd hit level 12 very early and enemies were brainless hp bags
today though, poe1 is harder indeed (although until level 12 or so, deadfire is just as hard/easy, it only gets piss easy in the latter levels)
 

FreeKaner

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The Adversary doesn't incite her to violence, it incites her to inflict suffering in such a way as to torture herself as well. That's why it tricked her into killing her mom. The culmination has to be killing her mom because something else happens after it, i.e. she snapping out of it and severing her connection to magic. A culmination is a turning point and the lowest a character goes to (in this context) before something different happens, a change in trajectory.

Adversary incites the emotions of anger and resentment she already possesses towards her father, but does so likely knowing they will manifest against her mother. There is no possession. Culmination is glory becoming vulnerable to manipulation due her spiralling to this life, the climax is her killing her mother.
 

fantadomat

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Hmmm i am pretty touchy when it comes to sjw shit,but never felt that there was that much in her. I don't even remember what is her comment on the wage gap. Breaking the nose of some dude made sense in this situation. Army is like prison,you have to show that you are not to be fucked early on. What i found SJW was the "racist" compound,it was really shit and i was rolling my eyes constantly. That is why i always let the guy run away.
Army is like prison,you have to show that you are not to be fucked early on.
Only in Eastern Europe, especially in Russia, where government not take their citizens & soldiers as humans - without any care or respect. I mean they take passport from soldiers during servitude (in fact stripping them from their citizenship), so any violence and torture against their own soldiers can be done without any consequences. It's kinda sad and ironic that you find such situation as some kind of norm in REAL life, while going all "pretty touchy when it comes to sjw shit" in COMPUTER game.

P.S.Well, I guess all people have their priorities. For someone reference of writer's political believes on another side of our planet is more important, than government's bad treatment of their own soldiers (you know, people who was respected during long history of mankind) on their side of our planet.
Geee it must be really nice living in that ivory tower of yours,abstracting yourself from the reality of the world. It must be really nice to be a US veteran,living the high life. Being called a nazi by jobless punks while pissing yourself in some alley,homeless. Hey at least they got freedom and progressiveness. In the East at least we respect our soldiers....when we have them.

PS:They take their passports for other reasons you dipshit.
 

Parabalus

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PoE1 is slightly harder for slightly longer. Tyranny is much harder.

Tyranny was much harder at the beginning for me (Edict of Execution part), but after you get one of the OP spell sigils the difficulty dropped off sharply, perhaps even below Deadfire.
 

AwesomeButton

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PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Make the Codex Great Again! Grab the Codex by the pussy Insert Title Here RPG Wokedex Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag. Pathfinder: Wrath
The Adversary doesn't incite her to violence, it incites her to inflict suffering in such a way as to torture herself as well. That's why it tricked her into killing her mom. The culmination has to be killing her mom because something else happens after it, i.e. she snapping out of it and severing her connection to magic. A culmination is a turning point and the lowest a character goes to (in this context) before something different happens, a change in trajectory.
Haven't played that game, but this sounds very deep.


Just like Morrigan.
:troll:
 

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