Eternity Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pre-DLC Thread [GO TO NEW THREAD]

[fantadomat]

Glory and Eiger are waaaay above what Obsidian can muster now. The only downside was "the Devil made me do it" angle of Glory, otherwise she was intriguing and beautiful.

I agree with you Lacrymas,both of them are really well written. Although i enjoyed the devil aspect,it was pretty interesting story. Also it didn't make her do it,there was always a choice .

You know who was down to earth and all the more interesting for it?

Spoiler

Obsidian do have an amazing skill to make interesting and human characters and then put them aside for the circus freaks. It is easily the best character in PoE. It is shame that JS doesn't like normal white women. Give him a furry faggot and he will be happy gay.

 

[Joni Odin von Hassenstein]

STOP! glorifying Eiger!

What's wrong with Eiger?

Eiger: "OMG, I'm llike, a victim of opression, like one day, I got like sexist misogynist remarks, and that's where I was like breaking that assholes bones, because he did so like deserve it!?"

You: 1. You should have tortured them instead.
2. You go grrrrrl!
3. You're stunning! And brave!
4. Thank you for doing good in this cruel world!
5. Maybe you could have hit him a bit softer, but I so get it!
6. Do you know that wymyn earn only 42% of what men earn for the exact same work?

 

[Parabalus]

STOP! glorifying Eiger!

What's wrong with Eiger?

What's so good about her?

My recollections of the SR:DF NPCs:

• Glory - edgy Bioware (tortured) npc, quest to kill her devil
• Eiger - no nonsense troll, betrayed ex-military, quest to interrogate enemy from military, hates you at start and starts hating less/respecting as you go along
• Dietrich - ex-Rocker, cool all around, quest about getting son from racists (tie-in), personal favorite
• Blitz - whiny cuck, quest about his debts in DC

 

[Sizzle]

Glory was basically a BioWare character - her "broken bird/waifu" aspect clashed badly with all the other characters, who were all more down-to-earth and all the more interesting for it.

She was still a professional who did her job excellently and that reflected on her character, her issues are separate from that, so she didn't clash with the team as shadowrunners. Having an abusive and extremist father isn't somehow out of this earth.

Eiger - an ex-special forces soldier with trust issues.

Dietrich - a cool old punk shaman.

Glory - an abuse victim who used her magic to work for the Devil, realized what she was doing was evul, and amputated her connection to magic by cyber-enhancing herself.

Now, out of all of these, can you tell me which one feels the most deliberately special?

 

[Lacrymas]

And being special is bad? You can say that about any of the characters. Physically strong female troll beats up guy and teaches you about feminism. Old punk who fights racists and teaches you about fascism. An airhead supergood decker who wants to find his girlfriend. All of these descriptions miss the point, exactly how "abuse victim fights her devils".

 

[Darth Roxor]

And why would some npc i met first time even know, worry or think im unmarried or not and bothered to call me such?

this is not different than calling a woman you meet 'miss' or 'mademoiselle'

Right, why are we using it for men all of a sudden?

because such cases exist as well

like "kawaler" in polando although you'd use it in closer/more familiar contexts

 

[fantadomat]

Glory was basically a BioWare character - her "broken bird/waifu" aspect clashed badly with all the other characters, who were all more down-to-earth and all the more interesting for it.

She was still a professional who did her job excellently and that reflected on her character, her issues are separate from that, so she didn't clash with the team as shadowrunners. Having an abusive and extremist father isn't somehow out of this earth.

Eiger - an ex-special forces soldier with trust issues.

Dietrich - a cool old punk shaman.

Glory - an abuse victim who used her magic to work for the Devil, realized what she was doing was evul, and amputated her connection to magic by cyber-enhancing herself.

Now, out of all of these, can you tell me which one feels the most deliberately special?

I can tell you which one have the longest description in your post. I can do it too.

Eider- ex merc

Deitrich - an old punk star band guy that fought neo nazi during xxxx year in Berling. After that he toured the world in search of meaning. Also he i a shaman that struggles of fine the strength to keep on going.

Glory - mech samurai

All of the characters are pretty interesting and well written.

 

[Kem0sabe]

Who the fuck gets a poe tattoo?

So much fucking decline of taste... and bad art.

 

[Sizzle]

And being special is bad?

No, being out of your way, trying-too-hard-to-be-special is bad.

You can say that about any of the characters.

If I desperately struggled to make an argument, like you're doing right now - sure, I could do that.

Physically strong female troll beats up guy and teaches you about feminism. Old punk who fights racists and teaches you about fascism. An airhead supergood decker who wants to find his girlfriend.

Yeah, dude, all of those are clearly in the same rang as "Possessed by the devil elfin girl with a dark and mysterious past she has to confront."

 

[Maculo]

Who the fuck gets a poe tattoo?


So much fucking decline of taste... and bad art.

I think the more pertinent questions are how much alcohol was involved, and how much money did she spend on it? Depending on the answer to those questions, it goes from cringe to sad.

 

[Lacrymas]

You are just salty I think PoE and SoD are on the same level. Glory is not tryhardy and is not Bioware level, you not liking her concept doesn't make her bad, "the Devil made me do it" does, or at least unsatisfying. And the things that have happened to her prior to that are logical. She also isn't coming to terms with her past, she has already made the choice to sever herself from it, she's trying to protect others from the same fate and punish the cult leader for taking advantage of young minds.

 

[Sacred82]

Some fabulous writing examples...
[snip]

started out well then dissolved into nitpicking. How you starve while surrounded by sea? By not having ocean-going ships and the weather being shit, for example.

we should criticize the writing based on examples more often, good idea, bad execution, 2/10

 

[Joni Odin von Hassenstein]

"the Devil made me do it" does, or at least unsatisfying.

 

[Parabalus]

You are just salty I think PoE and SoD are on the same level. Glory is not tryhardy and is not Bioware level, you not liking her concept doesn't make her bad, "the Devil made me do it" does, or at least unsatisfying. And the things that have happened to her prior to that are logical.

Any data to back these statements up?

This is not meant as an attack, I'd genuinely like to know how to best measure writing level of particular companions or something simpler, like PoE writing = SoD writing, a lot of such statements are thrown around here, but they're always personal opinions, would be nice to have something more tangible to refer to, even if just a poll.

 

[InD_ImaginE]

Wait I thought this is PoE thread instead of SR DF

 

[Lacrymas]

Any data to back these statements up?

This is not meant as an attack, I'd genuinely like to know how to best measure writing level of particular companions or something simpler, like PoE writing = SoD writing, a lot of such statements are thrown around here, but they're always personal opinions, would be nice to have something more tangible to refer to, even if just a poll.

I have talked about SoD at length and why I think it's not as bad as people make it out to be. It's not good, but it's not as bad either. You even participated in the conversation where we compared SoD and PoE. Here is where it starts. Polls won't do anything, this is not a popularity contest and popularity contests are bad arguments.

 

[Sizzle]

You are just salty I think PoE and SoD are on the same level.

No, and it speaks volumes of the strength of your argument that you even have to resort to mentioning something like that :D

Glory is not tryhardy and is not Bioware level, you not liking her concept doesn't make her bad, "the Devil made me do it" does, or at least unsatisfying. And the things that have happened to her prior to that are logical.

If by logical you mean "straight out of a character concept a BioWare fan would find riveting" then - yes.

Let's see, she was: abused until she discovered her magical powers, then abused harder, taken in by a cult introduced to her by her girlfriend, where she was yet again abused, became possessed by the Devil, killed kids, wanted to kill her dad, but accidentally killed her mom, which broke the cult's hold over her, and then decided to escape by cutting off her essence (and assorted body parts).

Wow, you're right - that's totally on the same level as a punk shaman, ex-military troll, and hacker.

She also isn't coming to terms with her past, she has already made the choice to sever herself from it, she's trying to protect others from the same fate and punish the cult leader for taking advantage of young minds.

I said "confront" her past, which is exactly what she does. Again, totally not BioWareian at all.

 

[FreeKaner]

Bioware didn't invent broken bird trope. That trope is not a bad trope either.

This uniqueness aversion cries conformist cuckold, honestly. It's very tryhard to get triggered by any sort of diversion from regular people. Especially when the alternative people are shown to have become so because of a troubled and hard past. Sure it can get suffocating when all the characters are like that but in case of SR: DF it wasn't like that. Why the outcries to have everyone as no nonsense down-to-earth professionals? Is this your "ideal person"?

Don't be so boring and shallow that you rally against any deviation from the norm, even in fucking cyberpunk video games.

 

[Infinitron]

https://jesawyer.tumblr.com/post/174148388501/are-the-many-many-adorable-cats-and-dogs-you-can

 

[Background Character]

What's wrong with Eiger?

She didn't want to hug me

 

[Parabalus]

Any data to back these statements up?

This is not meant as an attack, I'd genuinely like to know how to best measure writing level of particular companions or something simpler, like PoE writing = SoD writing, a lot of such statements are thrown around here, but they're always personal opinions, would be nice to have something more tangible to refer to, even if just a poll.

I have talked about SoD at length and why I think it's not as bad as people make it out to be. It's not good, but it's not as bad either. You even participated in the conversation where we compared SoD and PoE. Here is where it starts. Polls won't do anything, this is not a popularity contest and popularity contests are bad arguments.

I don't (didn't) disagree about your SoD writing level stance, especially in context of the Bg1 and Bg2 level.

I remember the linked, but I only commented about the amount of C&C and reactivity in SoD vs PoE and Bg content density, not the overall writing quality - the first can be quantified, the second isn't much more than opinion.

SoD has ridiculous meme tier lines, but is that enough to throw everything down into the trash (worse than PoE)? I have no idea. For me the voice acting threw everything into the ditch, I couldn't think about the writing disjointed from it.

How do you measure writing level in a game? What is writing? Do we divide it into categories? Who is qualified to judge it, if the public (Kodex [poll]) is unworthy?

There is a lot of of talk about writing quality here but I haven't seen the previous answered satisfactorily. It's easy for everyone to know what they like, it's instinctive, but how to translate that a "writing level score" which can be compared across games?

 

[Shadenuat]

would have been hilarious if you could fail the check and accidentally explode both your and Pai's ship > game over





So this time I helped slavers:
- Serafen said nothing
- I did get my death godlike slave but idk if he takes pay or not
- Party doesn't care if you murder every savage on island
- Slave master says you get discount on his finest stock... but don't think you can buy any more slaves

Screams like unfinished stuff to me

Also sacrificed Pallegina on Skaen altar. said to party "pallegina who?" and nobody seemed to mind. le irony

 

[AwesomeButton]

How do you measure writing level in a game? What is writing? Do we divide it into categories? Who is qualified to judge it, if the public (Kodex [poll]) is unworthy?

This question is why my approach is "assume that every game's writing is shit, don't expect anything but shit, and if a game strikes you as notable for its writing in a good way, count it as good". Examples: Planescape Torment has "good writing". Grim Fandango also has "good writing".

Since most books and movies don't deserve a serious look at their "writing", and they are supposed to be the more prestigious mediums, I think putting games under any sort of scrutiny is artificial.

I'm not saying you are one of those people, but people who seriously discuss Star Wars' and Avengers' plotlines and characters, and then sit down and get anal about some videogame's writing, are obvious poseurs.

 

[Mazisky]

Can someone tell me why Californians are so gay and sjw?

What's wrong with that part of Usa?

 

[Sizzle]

Bioware didn't invent broken bird trope. That trope is not a bad trope either.

No, but they practically started (and perpetuate) that entire fad in CRPGs.

This uniqueness aversion cries conformist cuckold, honestly. It's very tryhard to get triggered by any sort of diversion from regular people. Especially when the alternative people are shown to have become so because of a troubled and hard past. Sure it can get suffocating when all the characters are like that but in case of SR: DF it wasn't like that. Why the outcries to have everyone as no nonsense down-to-earth professionals? Is this your "ideal person"?

I don't mind uniqueness (even though Glory is anything but), what I do mind are cliches for the sake of uniqueness.

Are you telling me her story had to involve so much angst? That she had to be a victim of domestic, sexual abuse AND demonic possession?

It's not that she stands out because her story is so engaging compared to the other characters', but because hers is so trite and hamfisted.