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Eternity Pillars of Eternity II Beta Thread [GAME RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

Lacrymas

Arcane
Joined
Sep 23, 2015
Messages
17,948
Pathfinder: Wrath
I wouldn't reload every time a character got knocked out in PoE because I don't want to sit through the excruciatingly long loading screen.
 

Jimmious

Arcane
Patron
Joined
May 18, 2015
Messages
5,132
Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
The whole discussion about resting and how the player handles it is very similar to the question if a good CRPG should actively try to prevent save scumming or not.
Of course there are people that wont save scum (or rest spam) to cheese the games, but in my opinion a good CRPG finds ways to promote "correct" player behavior or even better provide options for any choice/outcome.
If there are clearly optimal ways to play people will tend to use them obviously.

TL;DR If the game allows resting 3 times in a row to be the optimal way to do stuff, most people will do it and they will probably miss some of the best aspects of the game. If you want to avoid that for your game, don't allow it to happen, somehow
I guess no resting is a solution...? I'm not sure
 

Brancaleone

Liturgist
Joined
Apr 28, 2015
Messages
1,004
Location
Norcia
The whole discussion about resting and how the player handles it is very similar to the question if a good CRPG should actively try to prevent save scumming or not.
Of course there are people that wont save scum (or rest spam) to cheese the games, but in my opinion a good CRPG finds ways to promote "correct" player behavior or even better provide options for any choice/outcome.
If there are clearly optimal ways to play people will tend to use them obviously.

TL;DR If the game allows resting 3 times in a row to be the optimal way to do stuff, most people will do it and they will probably miss some of the best aspects of the game. If you want to avoid that for your game, don't allow it to happen, somehow
I guess no resting is a solution...? I'm not sure
That's not the only way to frame the issue. If resting spots are limited, and the way they happen to be/become resting areas is integrated into the setting/plot/quests it adds to the game's layers (besides offering a combat reward that is not always loot/xp).
 

Tygrende

Arbiter
Joined
Aug 2, 2017
Messages
872
I think implementing soft time limits that start once you enter certain dungeons would be a pretty good and immersive way to disencourage rest spamming. I know a lot of people hate time limits in general, but I'm pretty sure players would be much less inclined to spend in-game days on sleeping and running back to the inn if it resulted in worse quest outcomes, missed opportunities to get unique loot, etc. Designing those limits right would require quite a bit of additional work though.
 

Lacrymas

Arcane
Joined
Sep 23, 2015
Messages
17,948
Pathfinder: Wrath
There are a bajillion ways to make resting mean something, but all of them make the game harder, and we can't have that now, can we?
 

fantadomat

Arcane
Edgy Vatnik Wumao
Joined
Jun 2, 2017
Messages
37,087
Location
Bulgaria
Without the refilling health,the game will be a lot worst. PoE combat lacks the enemy missing you or doing very little damage,most fights end up with you loosing decent amount of health and sometime having a knocked guy. Having no refill will make the game a rest spam after every combat.

Running back to inns is a noob thing,masters use the rest command :lol:.

The most enjoyable resting system,for me,was the one in MM games. Going mad and eating half your team is fun thing.
 

Immortal

Arcane
In My Safe Space
Joined
Sep 13, 2014
Messages
5,062
Location
Safe Space - Don't Bulli
the rest changes started because Josh saw people/customers (he doesn't like it!) rest spamming in IE games, so he went to the PoE system. Then he saw them doing something even worse, backtracking to inns so they could rest spam (he hates it!), so he went to the PoE2 system.

When I told him how I was playing it - reloading after anyone got knocked out, he didn't seem to understand/seemed frustrated by the fact that I wasn't playing it how it was designed :lol:


The mark of a great designer.. Sperg the fuck out when people don't do it how you want them to.
 

IHaveHugeNick

Arcane
Joined
Apr 5, 2015
Messages
1,870,124
It's the lifecycle of PoE threads. Every 25 pages all the retards who couldn't hack PoTD, start insisting that the game was actually too easy.

You see, it's not that they're shit players, who couldn't beat the game as it was designed, so they had to cheese the system. Not at all. They are amazing gamers who are very adept at videogames and the game was too easy for them. Honestly, it was. It's just the system was so bad, it forced them to cheese and save scum and rest spam and roleplay Skaen priests with daggers.

Seriously, that's what happened. It's not that they kept having full party wipes every 3 minutes to lonely unarmed Xaurips, until they've finally given up and started to look for shortcuts. It's the system. The system basically cheesed itself and it had nothing to do with decisions made by the guy at the keyboard who sucked at playing.

True story.
 

Immortal

Arcane
In My Safe Space
Joined
Sep 13, 2014
Messages
5,062
Location
Safe Space - Don't Bulli
It's the lifecycle of PoE threads. Every 25 pages all the retards who couldn't hack PoTD, start insisting that the game was actually too easy.

You see, it's not that they're shit players, who couldn't beat the game as it was designed, so they had to cheese the system. Not at all. They are amazing gamers who are very adept at videogames and the game was too easy for them. Honestly, it was. It's just the system that was so bad, it forced them to cheese and save scum and rest spam and roleplay Skaen priests with daggers. Seriously, that's what happened. The system basically cheesed itself and it had nothing to do with decisions made by the guy at the keyboard who sucked at playing.

True story.


> Implying POTD was an accomplishment.

Good meme's
 

fantadomat

Arcane
Edgy Vatnik Wumao
Joined
Jun 2, 2017
Messages
37,087
Location
Bulgaria
It's the lifecycle of PoE threads. Every 25 pages all the retards who couldn't hack PoTD, start insisting that the game was actually too easy.

You see, it's not that they're shit players, who couldn't beat the game as it was designed, so they had to cheese the system. Not at all. They are amazing gamers who are very adept at videogames and the game was too easy for them. Honestly, it was. It's just the system was so bad, it forced them to cheese and save scum and rest spam and roleplay Skaen priests with daggers.

Seriously, that's what happened. It's not that they kept having full party wipes every 3 minutes to lonely unarmed Xaurips, until they've finally given up and started to look for shortcuts. It's the system. The system basically cheesed itself and it had nothing to do with decisions made by the guy at the keyboard who sucked at playing.

True story.
Meh,don't care about such shit,i play to have fun,if i feel like cheating i cheat. Still PoE is not a hard game,lot easier than IE games. It is true that there is some "Hardcore" player in this thread,every time i read their post i do get a crack on my monitor. Still no need to go on a lengthy rant.

Also very few people play the game on hardest. I never felt the need of playing it on hardest.
 

santino27

Arcane
Patron
Joined
Oct 1, 2008
Messages
2,679
My team has the sexiest and deadliest waifus you can recruit.
Eh, I didn't feel like the might/strength/resolve changes accomplished their goal, so I'm fine with Obsidian rolling them back. In fact, I'm fine with them taking that approach for a lot of the deadfire changes.
 

Bonerbill

Augur
Joined
Nov 25, 2013
Messages
302
Location
North Carolina
It's the lifecycle of PoE threads. Every 25 pages all the retards who couldn't hack PoTD, start insisting that the game was actually too easy.

You see, it's not that they're shit players, who couldn't beat the game as it was designed, so they had to cheese the system. Not at all. They are amazing gamers who are very adept at videogames and the game was too easy for them. Honestly, it was. It's just the system that was so bad, it forced them to cheese and save scum and rest spam and roleplay Skaen priests with daggers. Seriously, that's what happened. The system basically cheesed itself and it had nothing to do with decisions made by the guy at the keyboard who sucked at playing.

True story.


> Implying POTD was an accomplishment.

Good meme's

You're a retard like usual
 

Ulfhednar

Savant
Joined
Apr 29, 2017
Messages
809
Location
Valhalla
What was it they were trying to do wiht those stats before they reverted to PoE1?
Separate physical and magical damage.
In Pillars 1 and Deadfire (now), the Might and Resolve attributes affect the following:

  • Might - All Damage, All Healing, Fortitude Defense
  • Resolve - Concentration (Pillars 1 only), Deflection Defense, Will Defense
Players have noted the following over the past few years:

  1. If you're a caster, there's often not much reason to invest in Resolve (especially in Deadfire).
  2. From a *~ roleplaying ~* perspective, it feels weird to have muscley wizards casting high damage fireballs because they can bench 350 lbs.
So we are making these changes for the next Backer Beta build:

  • Strength - All Weapon Damage, Fortitude Defense
  • Resolve - All Healing, All Spell Damage, Deflection Defense, Will Defense
For ease of use, "Weapon Damage" means anything that's an equipped weapon, from a sword to a bow to a gun to Kalakoth's Minor Blights. This also means there's a benefit to making a high-Strength wizard (i.e., being a psycho melee "gish" wizard).
 
Self-Ejected

aweigh

Self-Ejected
Joined
Aug 23, 2005
Messages
17,978
Location
Florida
that sounds like a nice change. Also PoE 2 deadfires super easy moddable ability files all of these changes are 5 minutes away from being changed to whatever you want !!! (modders will fi it!)

i know when PoE 2 launches before I even fire up the game Im going to make all cooldowns twice as long because I find combat too chaotic (and no the speed slider doesnt address this it only slows down animations). Frankly speaking I think I will probably spend more hours tweaking abilities and variables to suit my taste than actually playing the game which is what happens to me with all easily moddable games... but that aint so bad.

the only easily moddable game that I spent dozens of hours tweaking shit only to end up going back to (mostly) vanilla values for full playthroughs was Fallout: New Vegas. Moddable ability files via a simple word editor is the no. 1 reason Im even looking foward to PoE 2 now.

alright thats my positive PoE post for the month. #shilling
 

Alienman

Retro-Fascist
Patron
Joined
Sep 10, 2014
Messages
17,046
Location
Mars
Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Make the Codex Great Again! Grab the Codex by the pussy Codex Year of the Donut Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
Found some interesting Pillars 2 magician concept art:

3iKwIz1.png
 

Prime Junta

Guest
There are a bajillion ways to make resting mean something, but all of them make the game harder, and we can't have that now, can we?

That's nonsensical on the face of it, because increased difficulty through one mechanic can always be balanced out by making the game easier through some other mechanic.

It's also not true in my view. The problem with most rest restriction mechanics isn't that they make the game harder: it's that they introduce boring, rote, and easy ways to work around them.
 

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