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Rise of the Tomb Raider - Watch Lara's bum in NextGen fidelity

Deflowerer

Arcane
Joined
May 22, 2013
Messages
2,052
Too bad that guy probably got a job offer due to that demo and will be involved with some popamoles in the future. It won't be finished either.
 

Ash

Arcane
Joined
Oct 16, 2015
Messages
6,235
Can't believe it's been 20 years and nothing even comes close to the experience of classic Tomb Raider games.

FUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUUCK.

Mind you, I played the first game for the first time 3-4 years ago.

:negative::negative::negative::negative::negative:

What is it in particular you're after? Particular elements or something very close to the full package cumulatively? In the past decade you won't find shit, but maybe the 90s/early 2000s can satiate.

1. Duke Nukem: Time To Kill and Duke Nukem: Land of the Babes (late 90s PS1 exclusives) were Tomb Raider clones set in the Nukem universe of crude humor and alien invasions.
Combat was slightly better than TR, though still PS1 control fuckery. There's no ultra heavy atmosphere, though still can be a bit heavy at times surprisingly, especially the medieval levels in Time To Kill. Unfortunately there's only a few basic puzzles. The platforming and level design are very competent. good soundtracks too, as you can expect from your typical good old game.
Consider checking them out. They're pretty good games as long as you don't go in for the combat so much (as a Tomb Raider fan would not, but a Duke Nukem fan would). A little underrated to be honest. They're not 10/10 but I rate them alongside classic TR somewhere. Probably slightly worse but good in their own right.

Time To Kill also had one of the most badass intros to a game ever.

2. Turok 1 & 2 maybe? Atmosphere? Check. Decent challenge? Check. Platforming? Yup. Complicated level design that demands close attention and navigation skills? Check. Exploration of the unknown? absolutely. As a bonus, it also has decent, near-Quake tier combat. It is a little different overall being a FPS, but it absolutely ticks most of the same boxes. And again if coming from TR you'll be trading a little bit of atmosphere for superior combat. Good deal imo.

Here's me playing through level 4 of Turok 2. The levels are huge, taking over an hour to beat, and I get lost once or twice despite being on a replay of the game. That's how you know it can be like Tomb Raider :D

It's tough. There really isn't a lot that is close to TR specifically, even though it shares a lot in common with what other games were doing back then. Try the games above though, they are the closest I can think of.

Other suggestions:

Dark Messiah of Might and Magic plays quite like Tomb Raider sometimes. Like from 20% of the way into the game up until 60%. Then it essentially becomes straight combat.
Montezuma's Return is said to be a bit like TR First person, but I've not played it and so can't recommend it.
Thief: The Dark Project shares some similarities. Platforming, exploration, atmosphere, puzzles, some mystical locations etc, though is quite stealth focused.

I'm sure there's some game I'm missing that hits the mark...maybe. Oh well.
 
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MaskedMan

very cool
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Codex 2012 PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 BattleTech A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
Closest clone is probably Indiana Jones and the Infernal Machine, even down to the spinning menu and the same keyboard controls iirc. Haven't played past the first couple levels so I can't really comment on the quality.
mystery.png
 

Ezekiel

Arcane
Joined
May 3, 2017
Messages
5,374
Slightly better how? It's a standard popamole (as you people call it) shooter, except instead of sticking to cover, you're forced to slowly crouch through the whole gunfight. Personally, I'd rather use a manual cover system than an automatic one like Tomb Raider's or Metal Gear Solid V's. Tomb Raider's permanent carry system has only four guns and you're forced to zoom to an over the shoulder view with slowed foot movement before every shot. The gunfights are almost always in little, enclosed arenas, with you crouched on one side and enemies appearing continually from the other, and are over too quickly

Slightly better how? First of all, I despise NuWombRaider, but it is SLIGHTLY better as a game than the likes of Gears or Uncharted. Uncharted is filled with so many non-game walking sim segments, while TR2013 only has a couple. TR2013 rewards exploration here and there rarely (even if poorly) with its hubs or occassional secret temple and whatnot while Uncharted and Gears offers very little meaningful non-linearity at all. The scripted segments and dumbed down platforming are just as declined in both Uncharted And TR2013. TR2013 DID have okay puzzles from time to time though, even if not as elaborate and non-handholdey as the original's. Combat...I wouldn't call it good in either games, but it's probably an improvement over the classic auto aim shit in the older Tomb Raider games, if we also ignore the fact it has regen health, checkpoints you every corner, forces you to a snail pace while aiming and other such related modern trash design.

The game's shit popamole, but nightmare desert island scenario where only popamole accompanies you 'till death I'd add it to the pile of popamole I wouldn't immediately toss. Gears otoh would be the first to go. The SP campaign is pure trash.
I partly agree with you. But, if you're gonna go so hard in the action route and you do it well, then I won't mind that your game has little exploration. I'm not gonna bash Streets of Rage 2 just because there's no platforming and what have you. I like the Max Payne games even if they're pretty linear and almost purely action. While Uncharted doesn't have very good controls, I still enjoy it more as an action game than TR2013. The gunfights are bigger and longer, they involve more climbing and running and there are more guns. It also has better music, better looking environments (artistically) and setpieces that aren't as laughable, which all adds to the action. TR2013, like you said, doesn't have particularly good exploration. I also despise the character. Nate, while annoying at times, is more convincing as a pulp action hero than this new Lara.
 

Ash

Arcane
Joined
Oct 16, 2015
Messages
6,235
Uncharted often has bouts of exploration, point is it serves little gameplay purpose. Take Madagascar or that house you rob with your brother in Uncharted 4. You can explore but you'd just be wasting your time for the most part, unless you're really into concept art or whatever it is Uncharted's exploration yields, I forget. Pretty sure you're forced walking through most of the house robbing mission too (interior of the house). It's all in service to the cinematic experience and story. TR2013 at least makes some concessions for gameplay, even though it's still shit.

Edit:

You can explore but you'd just be wasting your time for the most part, unless you're really into concept art or whatever it is Uncharted's exploration yields, I forget.

How can I forget. ACHIEVEMENTS!111 The autists love those.
 
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Lyric Suite

Converting to Islam
Joined
Mar 23, 2006
Messages
56,172
The biggest sin of this game is turning Lara into generic cutesy waifu. You know the amount of testosterone the developers have approaches zero when that shit happens.
 

Drakron

Arcane
Joined
May 19, 2005
Messages
6,326
Uncharted often has bouts of exploration, point is it serves little gameplay purpose. Take Madagascar or that house you rob with your brother in Uncharted 4.

You mean Uncharted 4 specifically, not the other entries on the series and yes, those stick out as previous non-combat usually had platforming and puzzle sections.
 

Lyric Suite

Converting to Islam
Joined
Mar 23, 2006
Messages
56,172
Ye, you are right. Modern fakeplay is just the biggest cancer of all.

Still, turning Indiana Jones with tits into sobbing waifu teen was just retarded. And what's with all those gruesome death sequences? The fuck was with that?
 

Cross

Arcane
Joined
Oct 14, 2017
Messages
2,983
Ye, you are right. Modern fakeplay is just the biggest cancer of all.

Still, turning Indiana Jones with tits into sobbing waifu teen was just retarded. And what's with all those gruesome death sequences? The fuck was with that?
http://www.eurogamer.net/articles/2...-make-tomb-raider-players-want-to-protect-her

Players will want to "protect" an increasingly-battered Lara Croft in the upcoming Tomb Raider reboot, its executive producer has said.

The series' young heroine will lose her best friend, be beaten, bruised, kidnapped, and finally be subjected to an attempted rape.

"When you see her have to face these challenges, you start to root for her in a way that you might not root for a male character," executive producer Ron Rosenberg explained to Kotaku.
:prosper:
 

Ash

Arcane
Joined
Oct 16, 2015
Messages
6,235
Was probably so they could make something controversial and eye-catching, a talking point etc for the marketing. Certainly worked if that was the case, which it most likely was.
 

Drakron

Arcane
Joined
May 19, 2005
Messages
6,326
Maybe he did, ever heard of ryona?

Still it didnt do as Square Enix expected and its sequel was only because Microsoft payed development costs for a timed exclusive that ended in a plot hook ... the second game not only continues the destruction of Lara into a stereotypical "strong women" (AKA anything but that) but added a sequel hook for a story so lame it looked like it was stolen from a game turned into a movie ... oh! they did rip off the bad guys from the first Tomb Raider movie more or less, except Lara in the movie wasnt so pathetic.
 

Ezekiel

Arcane
Joined
May 3, 2017
Messages
5,374
Uncharted often has bouts of exploration, point is it serves little gameplay purpose. Take Madagascar or that house you rob with your brother in Uncharted 4. You can explore but you'd just be wasting your time for the most part, unless you're really into concept art or whatever it is Uncharted's exploration yields, I forget. Pretty sure you're forced walking through most of the house robbing mission too (interior of the house). It's all in service to the cinematic experience and story. TR2013 at least makes some concessions for gameplay, even though it's still shit.
You mean Uncharted 4 specifically, not the other entries on the series and yes, those stick out as previous non-combat usually had platforming and puzzle sections.
I've actually never played U4, only the first three. Never got a PS4 and I still don't know if I ever will. I think I heard U4 has less actual gameplay. But the puzzles of the previous games (usually involving the journal) weren't so good either, and the platforming had the usual automation of today, making it hard for the player to screw up. I still thought it did action slightly better than Tomb Raider, even if it was another cover shooter. But I haven't played those games in a few years. Uncharted 1 and 2 are both like 3 out of 5s for me, while TR2013 is a 2. Definitely not shining examples of third person shooting mechanics, any of them.
 

DemonKing

Arcane
Joined
Dec 5, 2003
Messages
5,958
I replayed TR2013 recently and still really enjoyed it - it's not classic TR but it's a rollercoaster from start to finish and the action is just plain fun.

RotTR I may get back to eventually. It didn't do as much for me as the reboot but that could be more to do with me liking the setting and pacing of the first game better. I recently bought the Baba Yaga DLC at discount but have to say even then it was brief and not great value. I do remember the tomb puzzles being a bit more involved in RotTR though than the reboot, but otherwise it's not nearly as good for mine.
 

Martius

Liturgist
Joined
Nov 24, 2013
Messages
1,058
I can't imagine how anyone with a strong dislike for Gears could possibly like Binary Domain considering how similarly they play.
It's Japanese. That's all it takes for some people.
If anything I would say the reason is game being made by team behind Yakuza games. Yes, it is cover shooter but its not copy of Gears of War. For example, since all enemies are robots they can still function in some way after losing limbs or head (for example after destroying robot head it may start shooting at other robots since it lost sensors). Banter between characters is for sure fun than all serious tone of Gears. Its more of different take on genre, just like Vanquish from Platinum Games.
 

Cross

Arcane
Joined
Oct 14, 2017
Messages
2,983
I can't imagine how anyone with a strong dislike for Gears could possibly like Binary Domain considering how similarly they play.
It's Japanese. That's all it takes for some people.
If anything I would say the reason is game being made by team behind Yakuza games. Yes, it is cover shooter but its not copy of Gears of War. For example, since all enemies are robots they can still function in some way after losing limbs or head (for example after destroying robot head it may start shooting at other robots since it lost sensors). Banter between characters is for sure fun than all serious tone of Gears. Its more of different take on genre, just like Vanquish from Platinum Games.
I will give Sega credit for implementing some form of dismemberment mechanic, which is always cool to see. But it matters little when how you move and shoot, i.e. the actual gameplay, is very much like Gears. Cover is far from the only thing these games have in common. It's also:
  • regenerating health;
  • a general lack of mobility (you move slowly, you can't jump, sideways movement i.e. strafing is much slower than moving forward, etc.);
  • your aim is deliberately made inaccurate so that you have to rely on 'aim mode'/iron sights;
  • movement is already slow, but it's slowed down to an absolute crawl when you go into aim mode/iron sights which also zooms in and lowers your FOV significantly, making movement very cumbersome;
  • you can't shoot while moving at a decent pace, sprinting is a separate mode that lowers your gun and doesn't allow you to shoot.
Almost every shooter made in the last 10 years, whether first or third person, follows the above principles. You can't really move and shoot in these games, it's always effectively one or the other. Even Vanquish has all of the above, despite ostensibly being a fast-paced shooter (obviously it replaces sprinting with sliding, but the principle is the same). The cover system is just a symptom of a much greater problem.
 
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Machocruz

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Joined
Jul 7, 2011
Messages
4,321
Location
Hyperborea
Dead Space and RE4/5 are the only OTS shooters I can stand. They are built around the aim mode. I think RE4 and 5 in particular have a kind of brilliant combat design, the stunning shot-to-melee mechanic in particular. Straight shooting to center mass with many of the weapons is not a great way to go about things, and not as interesting. Then you combine this with the utility of grenades, weapon variety, enemy variety, inventory space limitations, use of environment, etc. Good stuff.

But these other games don't have a particular vision for combat, so they just copy whatever the last similar, successful game is doing.
 

Ezekiel

Arcane
Joined
May 3, 2017
Messages
5,374
I like Max Payne 3's third person gunplay the most. It has a good balance of regular aiming and over the shoulder. I do a lot of running and gunning in that game, and the accuracy is pretty good. I also like the physics, especially when I'm dodging and getting thrown around by explosions and immediately follow that up with more kills. It's just a shame that you only get to use the faster foot movement, grenades and manual melee (and melee weapons) in the multiplayer and that the single player levels are so linear and chopped up by cutscenes. There's a lot to improve and add to Max Payne, especially mechanically. I wish those games had been more successful and influential. GTA V's (same developer) movement was pretty poor in comparison, yet it sold an insane amount of copies for some reason. Makes me sad knowing these devs can make pretty good third person shooting mechanics but choose not to because players like them slow.
 
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Zombra

An iron rock in the river of blood and evil
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Make the Codex Great Again! RPG Wokedex Strap Yourselves In Codex Year of the Donut Codex+ Now Streaming! Serpent in the Staglands Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 BattleTech Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag. I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
Tagging AwesomeButton since he is considering playing Rise. First, link to my long-winded Steam review.

Summary: there are a lot of disappointments with the game, but if you go in with the attitude of really wanting to like it, you can enjoy it. Just don't 100% it because for me it really wears out its welcome that way. Take time on puzzle tombs only and rush everything else.
 
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