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Seven: The Days Long Gone - Thief-inspired isometric action-RPG from former CD Projekt devs

toro

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This game is hilariously bugged. Whenever I load, all NPC:s immediately start running back towards what I assume to be are their default positions, before they start to engage in their random behaviour. This can be both abused (an enemy is coming towards you? save and reload, and he'll walk away!) and be extremely frustrating (you're sitting in a safe spot, and you saved? Surprise! Whenever you load, the NPC you were shadowing will immediately turn around and look at you.)

The same shit happens in the 1st Styx game. They don't save NPCs positions or state therefore you get all kinds of "artifacts" after loading save games.

Anyway, this is a major bug. I will wait for them to fix it.
 

Roguey

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The same shit happens in the 1st Styx game. They don't save NPCs positions or state therefore you get all kinds of "artifacts" after loading save games.

I didn't notice this at all so they either fixed it or I chose great places to save.
 

toro

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The same shit happens in the 1st Styx game. They don't save NPCs positions or state therefore you get all kinds of "artifacts" after loading save games.

I didn't notice this at all so they either fixed it or I chose great places to save.

I assume you saved as a normal user when you were safe but the issue was obvious if you saved surrounded by enemies.

It's somewhat retarded but it happened.
 

Luckmann

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Use a controller
If I wanted to have muppet peripherals mandated, I'd play console games.
Don't use secondary attack if you don't want big jumps forward.
I don't - spamming regular attacks constantly jumps you forward, and secondary attacks are rarely necessary anyway.
It loads fast on my SSD.
It loads like ass on my SSD, which wouldn't be so bad if the game wasn't so fucked as to require save-scumming like a mofo, like how there's no way to predict patrol movements at all, and you can have a dude go into a corner, load, and then sit and fast-forward two full days without that dude ever coming back to that corner despite being in the fucking warehouse, load again, and have it happen right away, or sometimes they stop for 5 seconds before turning around, sometimes they stand around for 30 or more, or how after any kind of "action" (including climbing up or taking a step down a ledge) you get taken out of stealth and start walking - and guards hear that walking instantly, even a single step, even through the thickest of walls, and run around entire compounds to get to where they heard you take that single step.

Sure, it's "realistic" I guess, but it makes it near-impossible to make any plans, and with psychic guards, you need to rely on plans, because if you place traps the enemy beelines straight for you even if you're sitting in a bush. Instantly goes to that exact bush and starts poking into it, essentially making traps useless.
The same shit happens in the 1st Styx game. They don't save NPCs positions or state therefore you get all kinds of "artifacts" after loading save games.

I didn't notice this at all so they either fixed it or I chose great places to save.

I assume you saved as a normal user when you were safe but the issue was obvious if you saved surrounded by enemies.

It's somewhat retarded but it happened.
And in SEVEN, you're never not surrounded by enemies or NPC:s. Loading in a town is hilarious, because suddenly everyone runs around like there's a fire.
 

Junmarko

† Cristo è Re †
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For anyone playing at 21:9, this user has detailed a fix - Seven: The Days Long Gone - 3440x1440

DEFAULT

508FAFB0670148E8F3F41D068B91D7E83E9E5B3C


FIXED

DF0B814817BC5408DAC8846BC9D8B9DB1AD90BB5
 
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Achiman

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Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 BattleTech
I want to play this but... 26 USD... what do they think this nearly is as good as grimore or something?!!
I'll get it when it's $10 steam sale price thanks.
 

LESS T_T

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Codex 2014
https://www.gamasutra.com/view/news...cher_devs_behind_Seven_The_Days_Long_Gone.php

Some RPG insight from the ex-Witcherdevs behind Seven: The Days Long Gone

If you're in the business of making role playing games, you should probably have an eye on Seven: The Days Long Gone. It's a fascinating isometric stealth RPG with a gonzo setting and interesting traversal mechanics from studios IMGN.PRO and Fool's Theory, whose founders have a history at Witcher developer CD Projekt Red.

Over on the Gamasutra Twitch channel today, we were lucky enough to be joined by lead developer Jakub Rokosz and quest designer Karolina Kuzia-Rokosz (both late of The Witcher 3), who were eager to share stories about the game's development process, and dive into the technical and design decisions that went into this unique RPG.

It was an illuminating chat, which you can watch in its entirety up above, but in case you're creeping around the island of Peh as we speak, here's a few key takeaways from our conversation.

Stealth games are about "idiot npcs"

When asked to quickly sum up what they feel makes a good stealth game, Rokosz and Kuzia-Rokosz talked about a need for players to feel smarter than AI characters. Of course, since the computer literally knows where the player is at all times, it then becomes necessary to make your AI really, really stupid, so that the player doesn't feel discouraged or outmatched.

When asked for what kind of stealth games inspired the sneaking mechanics of Seven, Rokosz and Kuzia-Rokosz tossed out a few familiar names like Dishonored and Thief, but excitedly pointed to the interactions in Fallout 2 where players could sneak up on NPCs and leave grenades in their pockets (Rokosz said a similar feature almost made it into Seven, but was killed to manage scope).

What makes a good RPG quest

Since Kuzia-Rokosz was the game's quest designer, we asked her to sum up what makes a good quest in an RPG like Seven. Her first response was that it's important for quest designers to think about enabling different playstyles, especially in a game like Seven, where there's a range of options on the speaking--->brawling spectrum.

Then Rokosz chimed in to remind her of one of the reminders she gave him constantly during development: that every quest needs to be clear about "what to do, where to go, how to do it," even when it's trying to be open-ended. This was apparently advice that Kuzia-Rokosz would badger him with constantly while implementing quests in gameplay.

How to make a good "detective vision"

In Seven: The Days Long Gone, players can use the protagonist's robotic eye to scout the environment around them and highlight loot and hiding places useful to completing missions. This feature is similar to the "detective vision" features seen in titles like Arkham Asylum and Assassin's Creed. It turns out that Rokosz and the rest of the team were worried players would leave such a feature on all the time, so they tried to have their mechanic "gamify" the main character pausing to take a look around, help him gather information in a similar way that the player wants.

Kuzia-Rokosz also pointed out to us that when they let players toggle this vision mode on and off, it quickly led to information overload since too many icons would pop in to the screen at the same time.

 

Luckmann

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When asked to quickly sum up what they feel makes a good stealth game, Rokosz and Kuzia-Rokosz talked about a need for players to feel smarter than AI characters. Of course, since the computer literally knows where the player is at all times, it then becomes necessary to make your AI really, really stupid, so that the player doesn't feel discouraged or outmatched.
That's funny, because if you actually do a non-lethal takedown in the game and run away, say, out the window, around the corner, run one-or-so screens away, and duck into a bush, the enemy will sprint to the bush - straight to it - the moment they wake up, and start looking for you in that exact bush. Enemies will react to the sound of you walking past them, even if you're wearing full disguise, and even if you're not even on the same floor - but they'll obviously not care at all about their fellow guardsmen walking around on the floor above them, and guards will become psychically aggroed through walls if you piss off a single one of them.

Also, calling the game an RPG is extremely generous. It's got some nice RPG themes and options, and I think that the progression system is fresh albeit slightly fucked (far too many RPG:s depend on rampant numbers inflation; a completely static baseline is actually really nice), but I'd never call this an RPG.

That said and despite me ripping on it earlier, I hope the game does really well, because the format is nice and the world is overflowing with tropes (or clichés) but still manages to tie together to feel fresh and interesting, and I genuinely hope that it gets some really quality expansion content or a good sequel that is an evolutionary extension of the existing game (i.e. almost identical, just with more iteration and developmental experience, less bugs, etc.).

It actually could be the foundation for a really good single-character RPG (and I say this as someone that prefers parties).

In many ways, it almost feels like an extremely well-developed proof-of-concept for a full RPG, or as a very early Beta.
 
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ArchAngel

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When asked to quickly sum up what they feel makes a good stealth game, Rokosz and Kuzia-Rokosz talked about a need for players to feel smarter than AI characters. Of course, since the computer literally knows where the player is at all times, it then becomes necessary to make your AI really, really stupid, so that the player doesn't feel discouraged or outmatched.
That's funny, because if you actually do a non-lethal takedown in the game and run away, say, out the window, around the corner, run one-or-so screens away, and duck into a bush, the enemy will sprint to the bush - straight to it - the moment they wake up, and start looking for you in that exact bush. Enemies will react to the sound of you walking past them, even if you're wearing full disguise, and even if you're not even on the same floor - but they'll obviously not care at all about their fellow guardsmen walking around on the floor above them, and guards will become psychically aggroed through walls if you piss off a single one of them.

Also, calling the game an RPG is extremely generous. It's got some nice RPG themes and options, and I think that the progression system is fresh albeit slightly fucked (far too many RPG:s depend on rampant numbers inflation; a completely static baseline is actually really nice), but I'd never call this an RPG.

That said and despite me ripping on it earlier, I hope the game does really well, because the format is nice and the world is overflowing with tropes (or clichés) but still manages to tie together to feel fresh and interesting, and I genuinely hope that it gets some really quality expansion content or a good sequel that is an evolutionary extension of the existing game (i.e. almost identical, just with more iteration and developmental experience, less bugs, etc.).

It actually could be the foundation for a really good single-character RPG (and I say this as someone that prefers parties).

In many ways, it almost feels like an extremely well-developed proof-of-concept for a full RPG, or as a very early Beta.
This is good because wearing disguises would make it too easy. This makes it so you can walk and not sneak but still need to not let guards get too close and not stay close to them for too long. Simulates D&D pretty well were wearing a disguise and letting others get a good look at you for long enough lets them roll their spot checks vs your disguise check.
 

Luckmann

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When asked to quickly sum up what they feel makes a good stealth game, Rokosz and Kuzia-Rokosz talked about a need for players to feel smarter than AI characters. Of course, since the computer literally knows where the player is at all times, it then becomes necessary to make your AI really, really stupid, so that the player doesn't feel discouraged or outmatched.
That's funny, because if you actually do a non-lethal takedown in the game and run away, say, out the window, around the corner, run one-or-so screens away, and duck into a bush, the enemy will sprint to the bush - straight to it - the moment they wake up, and start looking for you in that exact bush. Enemies will react to the sound of you walking past them, even if you're wearing full disguise, and even if you're not even on the same floor - but they'll obviously not care at all about their fellow guardsmen walking around on the floor above them, and guards will become psychically aggroed through walls if you piss off a single one of them.

Also, calling the game an RPG is extremely generous. It's got some nice RPG themes and options, and I think that the progression system is fresh albeit slightly fucked (far too many RPG:s depend on rampant numbers inflation; a completely static baseline is actually really nice), but I'd never call this an RPG.

That said and despite me ripping on it earlier, I hope the game does really well, because the format is nice and the world is overflowing with tropes (or clichés) but still manages to tie together to feel fresh and interesting, and I genuinely hope that it gets some really quality expansion content or a good sequel that is an evolutionary extension of the existing game (i.e. almost identical, just with more iteration and developmental experience, less bugs, etc.).

It actually could be the foundation for a really good single-character RPG (and I say this as someone that prefers parties).

In many ways, it almost feels like an extremely well-developed proof-of-concept for a full RPG, or as a very early Beta.
This is good because wearing disguises would make it too easy. This makes it so you can walk and not sneak but still need to not let guards get too close and not stay close to them for too long. Simulates D&D pretty well were wearing a disguise and letting others get a good look at you for long enough lets them roll their spot checks vs your disguise check.
It's not that they look at you, though, or turn towards you when you walk past them, but that they literally hear you through the wall and come running, sometimes running around entire compounds to get to where you are. Them reacting when they see you acting oddly makes a lot more sense. For example, they don't give a single fuck if they see your doing parkour over the roof or using the windows instead of the doors, whereas they should absolutely investigate that shit and the detection meter should jump up a fair bit.

Instead, they hear you through walls and ceilings and come running - you can call it "good" in a completely artificial meta sense, because otherwise stealth would be trivial in the current ruleset, but it's still feels and looks fucking stupid. My suggestion would be to introduce other complications, such as specific doorways/passages actually scanning you (getting through a checkpoint gate while in enemy uniform is fucking BS; they scan your Visa identity, but can't notice that you're not a member of the Technomagi or the Biomancers?), or having the guards react to odd behaviour and actually come running as they do now when jumping through windows or climbing walls or (and this could be a tricky one) you appearing out of fucking nowhere.

Instead they chose to make landings from jumps and falls silent (in the latest patch), so that you could actually sneak around places without being affected by the guard's reaction's to sounds. Totally the wrong way to go about it. Don't make the player silent - change the guard's reactions and behaviour instead. They should absolutely turn towards (but not necessarily go chasing after) someone dropping down from the third floor.

Meanwhile, Decoy Grenades doesn't even seem to register through doors/walls at all. It all just feels inconsistent.
 

ArchAngel

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I guess it is a small team and they could not afford a lot of iteration of game's design. I still don't understand what is the point of choking someone unconscious if they are just going to get up 10s later.
 

Luckmann

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I guess it is a small team and they could not afford a lot of iteration of game's design. I still don't understand what is the point of choking someone unconscious if they are just going to get up 10s later.
Yeah, you barely have time to even loot them. If you want to choke someone out, you have to choke 'em out, steal their armour (and ONLY their armour, taking anything else is risking it) and then just BOLT straight out of there before they come to.

The only benefit I can see is that you can do it on pretty much anyone, whereas backstabs in the early game very rarely work at all. Early on, choking them out is the only way to get disguises.

Pro tip for anyone playing, by the way: once you've gotten to the point where you have access to the safehouse, head UP (and out) from the safehouse, take the north-east bridge away from the bluff/island the safehouse is on/in (straight towards a fast-travel panel you'll not be able to use yet), and head north, and jump into Zone 6 (*just* north of another fast-travel panel you can't use).

This'll take you to a hunter's camp/tower (it's big, can't miss it). A lot of these hunters have "Techno"-grade weaponry that you can pickpocket. They've even got Exceptional Techno Sword, Exceptional Techno Axe, Techno Crossbow/Techno Crossbow Repeater, and things like that. They can be fully upgraded, and will completely outclass anything you can get before that point. I was using a Toxic Blade, and even without upgrades, it more than doubled my damage, and once I got upgrades into it also outclassed the elemental damage completely.

Another tip: backstab/jump-stab/coup de grace multiplier isn't different from one weapon to another (bar specific upgrades), so for example, daggers don't inherently do better backstab damage than an axe). This means that if you want to ensure backstabs, carry a kitted-out axe with the upgrade that increases backstab damage. Since axes have a higher total damage, they'll simply do more backstab/jump-stab/coup de grace damage.

Having one weapon for combat and one weapon for takeouts is a good idea. (Unless you happen to, I dunno, enjoy fighting with the highest-damage-value weapon in combat anyway).

Edit: By the way, when I say "jump" into Zone 6, I really mean jump. There's no patrols or checkpoints in the way if you're heading in the right direction. There'll be one nearby, but you don't need to go through it at all, it'll take you in the wrong direction, even.
 
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Luckmann

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So much controversy! I bought this game the day of release, but sadly, my computer broke on the same day - I am waiting on my new one.
On the bright side, you won't have to deal with a lot of shit that was frustrating as hell in the first release. They've actually fixed a ton of minor issues already. I still think it's unforgivable to release the game in the state it was released in, especially if so many issues could've been fixed in holding back just a week or two (just adding to the feeling that this was a mass beta). There's still tons of issues and I some aren't even bugs and are unlikely to ever be changed, but although your rig got fucked, in terms of this game, you can count yourself lucky.
 

Jinn

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So is this more around a 7/10 now that a good number of bugs have been addressed?
 

Luckmann

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So is this more around a 7/10 now that a good number of bugs have been addressed?
No, it's nowhere even near that. Maybe by modernist gaming journalist standards, but by my objective and superior judgement it is a 6/10 at best, and I think that is partially because I actually started over and approached the game differently after understanding "how it's supposed to be played", and learning to deal with design issues. This isn't something that can be expected by or requested of the player, and the game makes zero effort to actually convey this to the player.

It's not shit, really, it's just... A for effort, D- for execution. It's got some interesting things going for it, and the patching has been solid so far, but there's still tons of issues to fix, and some, I suspect, aren't really bugs, and would require more work than can be expected.
 

Heretic

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There was an update

d0106a0f2d885d51f157632845d2a7b6e6d98854.jpg

Hi again!

We're back with some changes and new fixes. The whole team put all effort into making Seven: The Days Long Gone better for you, so these last couple days we've been focusing on adjusting the sneaking mechanics to make it more user-friendly. By the end of the week, we expect to have an update ready that will address the gameplay and interface mechanics of back-stabbing enemies.

In the meantime, here is the rest of 1.0.4 changes:


Performance:
  • FIX: Optimization of determining attitude between teams.
  • FIX: Disabled Oculus Rift integration. Oculus headset should not capture audio anymore.

Gameplay fixes:
  • NEW: Show all available skill upgrades in skill panel (incompatible upgrades are greyed out).
  • NEW: Show base health and energy statistics in equipment panel.
  • FIX: Crouch will now be retained after climbing.
  • FIX: Crouch will now be retained after backstabs.
  • FIX: NPC AI behavioural reaction pass - NPC's will not be as sensitive to noise as before
  • FIX: Multiplying loot in Environment Puzzle with rotating cubes is no longer an issue.
  • FIX: Guards routines adjusted with spawn points at Checkpoint 02.
  • FIX: Visa Scan Drones have been turned off until their AI problems are solved.
  • FIX: Status effects displayed as white rectangles on HUD no longer present.
  • FIX: Lowered tall grass meshes to avoid confusion if it is sneaking spot. Added foliage footstep sound to tall grass.
  • FIX: AI Unit fixes for Technomagi in Warden's Hold bar, changed profile.
  • FIX: Removed improper action points for ghouls in Warden's Hollow.
  • FIX: Hard landing of player character no longer cancels crouch.
  • FIX: Disguise functionality added for Zealots and Warehouse guards in Warden's Hold.
  • FIX: Merchants friendly to each other - no more wild brawls in the merchant areas ;)
  • FIX: Input will no longer block on being hit by stun attack while using a ladder.
  • FIX: Overweight problem caused by obsolete hidden syringes no longer occurs.
  • FIX: Added missing tooltip stats to chips, abilities and weapon upgrade.
  • FIX: Displaying inappropriate attribute values in the character panel.
  • FIX: Weapon Upgrade Sight tooltip icon added.
  • FIX: NPCs stay asleep longer after choking.
  • FIX: Thief Lining Upgrade stats corrected.
  • FIX: Backstab bleeding, and energy drain tooltip icons added.
  • FIX: Jumpthrow upgrade tooltip icon added.
  • FIX: Removed choke push counter-attack on released input when choking an enemy.

Quest fixes:
  • FIX: "Master Brewer quest in Lewmer", one mapping added for the shrine, so it is easier to find.
  • FIX: "Butch's Day Off" listener (Butch released scene).
  • FIX: "Now Who Is The Crazy One" rotating crystal was not behaving properly upon loading a save game.
  • FIX: "What a Pair" - added feedback to player log about payment for returned socks.
  • FIX: "Exorcism For Beginners", fire burn area now playing proper fire sound.
  • FIX: Correct audio cues connected in dialogue with Ilsa in "Petals And Promises".
  • FIX: Patrol in Grukbara Mansion won't be running around anymore, they do patrol with their regular speed.
  • FIX: "Deep in the Mire" daemon has a proper response voice set now.
  • FIX: "Prickly Maneater" portal working properly, quest blocker removed, now it is possible to get back.
  • FIX: Removed blocker on dialogue with Drax during the "Wanted Man".
  • FIX: Biomancers removed from Mortbane after it was taken over by Voort followers.
  • FIX: Headhunters despawned after meeting Drax in "Wanted Man".
  • FIX: Teriel falling properly into the trap during the "A Wanted Man" quest.
  • FIX: "Exorcism for beginners", an old unused lamp was deleted.
  • FIX: "Petals And Promises", the merchant could no longer turn hostile after dialogue with him.
  • FIX: "Cinderman": Improper option to ask before the reward after getting rid of Cinder Man removed.
  • FIX: "The Vault", Final Artanak dialogue flow fixed.
  • FIX: Turned off Headhunters inside Warden's hold - too much mayhem caused by them, can still be found hunting for you in other areas.
  • FIX: It is no longer possible to exit the Artee village with the elevator staying on top.
  • FIX: Deactivated wall clock clue in Mayor's house can now be interacted with upon reaching Mayor without investigating the house.
  • FIX: Warden's Hold Master Crafter and Master Brewer are no longer turning hostile over and over again after entering their workshops.

Audio fixes:
  • NEW: Laughing reactions SFX.
  • NEW: SFX for tech rot leak devices added.
  • FIX: SFX fixes added to "Wanted Man scene.
  • FIX: Mixed properly cargo arrival audio in Safehouse Cutscene.
  • FIX: Replaced erroneous "planting charges" SFX with correct "syringe bandelisk" SFX in "You Skratch My Back".
  • FIX: Lewmer Cliffs Cue concurrency fix - now only single Cue is played resolving loudness issue.

Misc:
  • NEW: Save file details are now displayed on death screen.
  • FIX: Spelling errors in credits corrected.
  • FIX: Accessing not allowed panels using key shortcuts disabled.
  • FIX: Few NPC locations adjusted in Warden's Hold.
  • FIX: Duplicated gate removed from the scene in Warden's Hold.
  • FIX: Adjusted hunters locations at Hunters Camp in Everglade Swamps.
  • FIX: Smaller spawn trigger for spiders near Hunters Camp in Everglade Swamps.
  • FIX: Bandelisk navmesh snap parameters tweaked.
[/URL]
 

Luckmann

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There was a 1.05 patch today that was supposed to have fixed some of the disguise/controlled area issues, but so far, none of it appears fixed at all, I've in fact noticed MORE disguise/controlled area bugs (notably one controlled area where the enemies couldn't give less of a fuck if you walk around there without disguise), and I've logged at least ~5 separate, different bugs since I started playing today, and I haven't even bothered to log minor bugs (such as the ones that deal with world geometry, climbing through walls, not being able to climb certain objects that appear as if they should be perfectly climbable, or simply sliding off certain objects to me death).

I'm so fucking happy I didn't pay for this shit. At this point, I'm entirely convinced that the PC release of this game was really just a beta test for later console release. It explains the extremely shitty controls and the very rapid patching order, and the cleaning up/introduction of new features and polish.

I wouldn't be surprised if they announce a console release in just about a week or two, just for Christmas.
 

Alienman

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Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Make the Codex Great Again! Grab the Codex by the pussy Codex Year of the Donut Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
Kinda sad, seems to be a nice game. Played about 5 hours of it, but waiting for optimizing patch.
 

Jinn

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Kinda sad, seems to be a nice game. Played about 5 hours of it, but waiting for optimizing patch.

For $15 I think I'll take the plunge. Even if it doesn't execute everything it tries to do in an ideal way, I like the concept and that a game like this was made in the first place. It is sad that this release hasn't gone better all around for these guys.
 

Jinn

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Sorry to commit the dreadful faux pas of double posting, but I just wanted to share some initial impressions and say that I've been having a great time with this game in the 5 hours played so far. I've been particularly enthused about the freedom of movement and easily navigated verticality. I never expected the game to control as nicely as it does. The setting has been another pleasant surprise, as it seems to be an interesting and unique take on cyberpunk. Combat can be clunky, but I haven't had any serious problems with it yet.

Feels nice to be playing a decently competent stealth game from an overhead view with some nice RPG elements implemented. I'm reminded of Shadow Tactics in a very good way (though ST is clearly superior in terms of stealth gameplay). The majority of the backlash the game has received seems to be due to the buggy release, and rightfully so in a number of cases. It also seems that a lot of people weren't really sure what they should be expecting when they bought it. While there are different play style approaches offered, it seems at its core a stealth game, and the protagonist is most certainly a "thief."

I get the feeling that a number of gameplay flaws will rear their head at some point, but I don't think they will strip the sense of appreciation I have for this game, particularly as a studio's first foray.
 
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