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World of Darkness Werewolf: The Apocalypse – Earthblood - action-RPG adaptation from Cyanide

Ismaul

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I get the feeling this game won't have much to it.
Let's give it a chance before we trash it. Expecting Bloodlines level of quality, flaws and all, would be fabulously optimistic, but maybe they can do something at least competent enough is some areas. How they realize the atmosphere in the game might make it or kill it.
 

Alex

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I get the feeling this game won't have much to it.
Let's give it a chance before we trash it. (snip...)

What kind of place do you think you are in...

campaign_incline2014.png
campaign_2015.jpg
campaign_2016.png

campaign_divinityos.png
campaign_projecteternity.png
campaign_tidesofnumenera_cmcc.png

campaign_shadowrun_hongkong.jpg
campaign_dos2.jpg
campaign_battletech.jpg

campaign_desolate.jpg

Oh! Never mind...
 

the_1990

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Let's give it a chance before we trash it. Expecting Bloodlines level of quality, flaws and all, would be fabulously optimistic, but maybe they can do something at least competent enough is some areas. How they realize the atmosphere in the game might make it or kill it.

Hopefully this is just Paradox farming the license out to a *safe* company who will make an OK product, just as a way of testing the waters.

I hope that if/when we do get to the "big" WoD game we get something that combines the innovations of Dvivinity Original Sin 2 (extensive mod-support, GM-mode, general richness and depth) with the cinematic quality of games like Mass Effect or the Witcher.

But if all we get is just a string of the WoD equivalents of Space Hulk: Deathwing or Battlefleet Gothic then...

:decline:
 

Jaesun

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Let's give it a chance before we trash it.

Based on what exactly? Is there some game they have made that shows they are competent, and understand PnP mechanics very well in a Video Game (Like Obsidian/Black Isle know extremely well).

Looking at the list of games they have worked on, not seeing that. Unless I missed something...?
 

Ismaul

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Based on what exactly?
Based on nothing man, I don't know the dev. Just hoping/wanting to be pleasantly surprised, and giving the benefit of the doubt.

You talk about established RPG studios, but as far as I see those have mostly produced forgettable shit over and over and will again, while newcomers have made some promising stuff and tried new ways of doing things. So I'll just wait and see until we have something tangible to judge before I bash it, is all. Right now we have nothing to go on.
 

Jaesun

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Based on what exactly?
Based on nothing man, I don't know the dev. Just hoping/wanting to be pleasantly surprised, and giving the benefit of the doubt.

You talk about established RPG studios, but as far as I see those have mostly produced forgettable shit over and over and will again, while newcomers have made some promising stuff and tried new ways of doing things. So I'll just wait and see until we have something tangible to judge before I bash it, is all. Right now we have nothing to go on.

What specifically have they done that warrants such optimism? Please enlighten me.
 

ArchAngel

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Based on what exactly?
Based on nothing man, I don't know the dev. Just hoping/wanting to be pleasantly surprised, and giving the benefit of the doubt.

You talk about established RPG studios, but as far as I see those have mostly produced forgettable shit over and over and will again, while newcomers have made some promising stuff and tried new ways of doing things. So I'll just wait and see until we have something tangible to judge before I bash it, is all. Right now we have nothing to go on.
You forget this forum is full of Obsidiantards. Next time mention Inxile or something if you want to get your point across and people to agree with you. Leaving it vague makes it so everyone assumes you are talking about 7 review game and studio.
 

Ismaul

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What specifically have they done that warrants such optimism? Please enlighten me.
If you want to expect a shit sandwich with nothing to go on go full speed ahead. I could care less. Maybe I shouldn't have said "Let's give it a chance" as if I was including others in my view.
 

Xeon

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IIRC people said Game of Thrones RPG was kinda good but low budget so it will probably be the same, hopefully better.
 

thesheeep

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Yeah, I liked all of their games so far.
None of them were great, and all did show the limited budget, but all were very much enjoyable.

I really wouldn't put it past them to create something very good given some more resources for once.
 

Haba

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Based on what exactly? Is there some game they have made that shows they are competent, and understand PnP mechanics very well in a Video Game

:nocountryforshitposters:

Blood Bowl
Blood Bowl II

What specifically have they done that warrants such optimism? Please enlighten me.

Game of Thrones
Styx: Master of Shadows
Styx: Shards of Darkness

Even if their games certainly have faults, I have tons more optimism towards anything made by Cyanide than I do for shovelware producers like Obsidian.
 

Rahdulan

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Yeah, I liked all of their games so far.
None of them were great, and all did show the limited budget, but all were very much enjoyable.

I really wouldn't put it past them to create something very good given some more resources for once.

I like Cyanide because they're at least trying to do their own thing albeit with questionable results at times. For example, Spiders is another medium budget developer I like for their RPGs, but they're clearly aping Jade Empire/Mass Effect era Bioware sans the budget and experience. On the other hand it's not like Cyanide is free of blunders considering they made Confrontation and it has been good five years since their last RPG. We have yet to see how they're going to do in this generation with anything other stealth where they don't have to compromise for some wider audience. Their Call of Chtulhu title will be the real test.
 

LESS T_T

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Codex 2014
Werewolf related things from a recent interview with Whitewolf guys: http://onlysp.com/world-of-darkness-exclusive-interview/

About the not so fabulous reputation of Cyanide:

Perhaps best known for the Styx series of stealth games, Cyanide has a reputation for great ideas but flawed execution, leading some to question its suitability for such a high-profile project, however, Sjögren waves away any such concerns.“I think, at this time in the industry, it’s all about what your next game is and to identify the teams and publishers with the passion and drive to make that next great product. Looking at [Cyanide’s] experience with mixing heavy visual action with the RPG genre and the learnings they have made along the way is one thing that convinced us. But most importantly their awesome passion for Werewolf and its environmental themes… What we’ve seen from the game so far blows our mind and we feel absolutely certain that they will do a product not only represents Werewolf but is also a great visceral games experience.”

Sjögren’s confidence in the team stems not only from the work he has already seen on Werewolf, but also a philosophy built up over his 21 years in the gaming industry. “From my personal experience, I can say giving a dev with a less than perfect record a chance is sometimes a great idea. If the team I worked on in the past had been judged on the ratings and sales of their game Codename Eagle, the game Battlefield 1942 and its sequels would never gotten made and the world would be a less fun place. The very wise Tom Frisina was the one at EA who signed DICE at that time. He told me that ‘you are never better than your next game’ and that is something that stuck with me. What you need is a talented team with a vision and passion and absolutely magic products can be produced, and that is very much our feeling about all the partners we work with today.”

Nonetheless WW is heavily involved in the game's production, "frequently checking in and approving every part of the game, every piece of concept art, as a part of [the] licensing process" to ensures it "adheres to the rules and ideas of the original RPG":

The setting is grounded in the fantastic, yet its individual properties have always reflected social themes of perpetual importance. From the explorations of morality in Vampire: The Masquerade to the idea of balance in Mummy: The Resurrection, the World of Darkness is ripe with opportunities to engage with real-world issues. For the revitalisation of the IP, White Wolf decided to lean on this fact, rather than the brand recognition of Vampire: The Masquerade. As such, when Cyanide pitched a vision for Werewolf: The Apocalypse that homed in on the environmental themes and questioning of violence, White Wolf leapt at the idea.

“Not saying that Vampire can’t address burning contemporary issues, but holy s**t does Werewolf feel like the right story for our strange times,” Ericsson said. “The tagline for Werewolf is ‘When Will You Rage?’ It’s essentially a radical revenge fantasy where you become a savage warrior of nature, ripping oil-pipelines, corporate boardrooms and narrow-minded bigots to shreds. I think a large percentage of the world can relate to the anger and frustration the Garou feel as they watch us humans f**k up the planet. And on the flip side it asks the question ‘what’s the price of using violence to change the world’.”

Although Cyanide’s initial pitch was spot-on, White Wolf is heavily involved in the game’s production, frequently checking in and approving “every part of the game, every piece of concept art, as a part of [the] licensing process.” The close collaboration ensures that Werewolf: The Apocalypse adheres to the rules and ideas of the original RPG, with Ericsson saying that “the mechanics of Rage and Gnosis (spiritual wisdom) and interaction with the Umbra, the world of spirits both pure and corrupted… will be central to the game’s systems. And yes, you will almost certainly come face to face with the twisted corporate employees at Pentex subsidiaries like Endron Oil and fight next to some of the tragic heroes of the Garou!”
 

Rahdulan

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Fact that full-on SJW White Wolf is keeping tabs on the project should be what's worrying people, not Cyanide's supposed reputation. They've shown they can tackle serious subjects with shit like psychic rape in Of Orcs and Men, for example. Handle it and not hold back any punches.
 

Volken

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What if I want to embrace the Wyrm and turn the earth into toxic wasteland? Playing self-righteous garou will be boring as fuck.

Btw ripping oil pipelines doesn't sound like a smart idea when your goal is to prevent further pollution. ;)
 

InD_ImaginE

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Pathfinder: Wrath
Isn't basically doing any "bad" thing in OWD or NWD will pretty much result in game over anyway due to karma mater? The very nature of the setting is that you are fighting against your in-human nature instead of embracing it
 

Fedora Master

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What if I want to embrace the Wyrm and turn the earth into toxic wasteland? Playing self-righteous garou will be boring as fuck.

Btw ripping oil pipelines doesn't sound like a smart idea when your goal is to prevent further pollution. ;)

You don't rip the pipeline apart, you rip apart it's metaphysical manifestation in the Umbra, duh.
 

Eriador

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A big part of Werewolf is that Garou form packs. This lends itself to a "party-based RPG" with the PC as an alpha of their own pack formed by NPC companions, but I'm not sure how that would work in practice or even if they plan to go that route.

Also, there are 13 Tribes, 5 Auspices and 3 Breeds. Do they plan to include all of them or will they just heavily limit the choices? It wouldm't surprise me if they just had the PC be a Homid, because as hilarious as a wolf-born PC might be, I doubt they would do it justice.

Or maybe we'll just get a predefined PC. I don't know how to feel about this, adapting this would be a huge undertaking. Especially Umbra and the spirits.

Isn't basically doing any "bad" thing in OWD or NWD will pretty much result in game over anyway due to karma mater? The very nature of the setting is that you are fighting against your in-human nature instead of embracing it

Werewolves in OWD don't have any karma meter like Humanity for Vampires. Anyway, Werewolf isn't really about "fighting your in-human nature", since depending on your Breed, you might not even be human at all. Hell, if anything, it's about the exact opposite.
 

SCO

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Shadorwun: Hong Kong
I do wonder if the game will have a equivalent of the Masquerade level on bloodlines. Seems like a easy thing to steal, but I wonder what consequences will apply. In bloodlines, it spawned hunters, lowered the prince opinion and cutscene death'ed you after a bit.

Low humanity on VMB wasn't the 'game over' meter, it was masquerade. Low humanity would at most, get you killed because of frenzy with one of the bad frenzy clans - brujah and gangrel - while wounded and in combat. And it changed dialog and removed options naturally. Technically, it was also supposed to be a game over in lore, because you're supposed to become a bestial vampire without a mind permanently until you die but the devs wisely said 'screw that'.
 
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Eriador

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I do wonder if the game will have a equivalent of the Masquerade level on bloodlines. Seems like a easy thing to steal, but I wonder what consequences will apply. In bloodlines, it spawned hunters, lowered the prince opinion and cutscene death'ed you after a bit.

In Werewolf, you have Renown. If you gather enough Renown, you can advance in rank and gain higher status. This has a direct effect on your power, since the more powerful Gifts (magical abilities) can only be taught to you if you have sufficient rank (because the spirits that grant them will refuse to deal with you otherwise). Violating the "Veil" (AKA Masquerade, but the werewolf version) meant loss of renown, specifically honor renown. This would be easy enough to implement in a videogame.

Also, the Elders wouldn't like it very much and might choose to punish you if it was bad enough/you did it often enough. So they could have it affect the social aspect as well, assuming this isn't supposed to be just a hack-and-slash action game with corridor levels.

Low humanity on VMB wasn't the 'game over' meter, it was masquerade. Low humanity would at most, get you killed because of frenzy with one of the bad frenzy clans - brujah and gangrel - while wounded and in combat. And it changed dialog and removed options naturally. Technically, it was also supposed to be a game over in lore, because you're supposed to become a bestial vampire without a mind permanently until you die but the devs wisely said 'screw that'.

That was because the game wouldn't let you get low enough Humanity. You become a mindless beast only at 0 Humanity. And tbh, having minimal Humanity already sucked, since you'd Frenzy all the time.
 
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Xeon

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Redemption had a vampire rank based on exp or levels, the higher you go the higher your rank will go I think, it kinda sounds somewhat similar to that from how you describe it.

Haven't played Redemption past Vienna so not sure if ranks do anything.
 

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