Community Pathfinder: Kingmaker Codex Fundraiser - Better Late Than Never

[Wayward Son]

Which shows how bad their encounter design is, they're setting up themes, in chapter 1 we're fighting bandits, in chapter 2 trolls, etc. Linear ...[snip] with almost no quests between the fights...[snip] you will have fights, fights and some more fights and it's the most important part of the game.

So..., they're making IWD with MCA writing and Pathfinder rules? And you think this is a bad thing?

 

[Goral]

So..., they're making IWD with MCA writing and Pathfinder rules? And you think this is a bad thing?

Yes, I don't like Baldur's Gate let alone Icewind Dale. One of the most boring games I know.

 

[PrettyDeadman]

So..., they're making IWD with MCA writing and Pathfinder rules? And you think this is a bad thing?

Yes, I don't like Baldur's Gate let alone Icewind Dale. One of the most boring games I know.

I don't believe you.

 

[Wayward Son]

So..., they're making IWD with MCA writing and Pathfinder rules? And you think this is a bad thing?

Yes, I don't like Baldur's Gate let alone Icewind Dale. One of the most boring games I know.

Sir... What in the fuck. IWD is many things, it is linear, it doesn't have much C&C, but it isn't boring. Maybe it's boring if you play it on Easy, I wouldn't know.

 

[Goral]

I don't believe you.

I've never been a BG fan.
http://www.rpgcodex.net/forums/inde...view-at-gamebanshee.88659/page-5#post-3025298 (Baldur's Gate I/II had also such bland quests)
http://www.rpgcodex.net/forums/inde...dam-heine-explains-effort.97378/#post-3771966 (BG isn't that good in the first place)
http://www.rpgcodex.net/forums/inde...gs-vote-only-thread.88946/page-7#post-3050856 (indirect proof that BG is very low on my list of best RPGs)

Maybe it's boring if you play it on Easy, I wouldn't know.

lol
Implying that ID is hard on higher difficulty settings... RTwP is what makes it super easy and super boring.

 

[Wayward Son]

Implying that ID is hard on higher difficulty settings...

How far have you actually gotten in the game?

 

[Goral]

I don't remember, I've played it over 10 years ago (probably closer to 15).

 

[Iznaliu]

I don't remember, I've played it over 10 years ago (probably closer to 15).

Truly a reliable source.

 

[Wayward Son]

Truly a reliable source.

Hey hey, I'm not much more reliable. I last played it over 10 days ago (probably closer to 15).

 

[Black]

lol fundraiser for rtwp
Get a fundraiser to ban Finitron and watch the gold flow.

 

[Greyfox12311]

I can't get past how much the game play reminds me of Tyrany. I love Patfinder and RTwP but, I just can't make up my mind on this one...

 

[Iznaliu]

I can't get past how much the game play reminds me of Tyrany.

How does it remind you of Tyranny? I haven't found time to watch the video; but that is not what I would think based on what other commenters are saying.

 

[Bumvelcrow]

I can't get past how much the game play reminds me of Tyrany. I love Patfinder and RTwP but, I just can't make up my mind on this one...

Joined: Today

Sorry Foxy, but this one was truly deserved.

 

[Iznaliu]

I need to remind myself to fund this thing.

 

[fobia]

I can't get past how much the game play reminds me of Tyrany.

How does it remind you of Tyranny? I haven't found time to watch the video; but that is not what I would think based on what other commenters are saying.

It has one thing in common: Hovering over highlighted stuff in conversation gives you the lore pop up, like in Tyranny. That's it.
He's just trying to be edgy.

 

[Iznaliu]

It has one thing in common: Hovering over highlighted stuff in conversation gives you the lore pop up, like in Tyranny. That's it.

It also shares RTwP with Tyranny.

 

[ArchAngel]

It has one thing in common: Hovering over highlighted stuff in conversation gives you the lore pop up, like in Tyranny. That's it.

It also shares RTwP with Tyranny.

More like they both share RTwP with Baldur's Gate.

 

[Alex]

Which shows how bad their encounter design is, they're setting up themes, in chapter 1 we're fighting bandits, in chapter 2 trolls, etc. Linear ...[snip] with almost no quests between the fights...[snip] you will have fights, fights and some more fights and it's the most important part of the game.

So..., they're making IWD with MCA writing and Pathfinder rules? And you think this is a bad thing?

Pathfinder is boring and MCA is overrated.

 

[Wayward Son]

Pathfinder is boring and MCA is overrated.

I respectfully disagree (well, MCA might be a little over rated round these parts, but he's still a good writer.)

 

[Black]

MCA is cool but not good enough to be a fucking stretchgoal in himself.

 

[Alex]

Pathfinder is boring and MCA is overrated.

I respectfully disagree (well, MCA might be a little over rated round these parts, but he's still a good writer.)

What I dislike about MCA (or at least his games, I don't really know what he specifically wrote and what was done by someone else) is that he always seem to be trying to bite more than he can chew. His stories always seem to try to tackle philosophical themes that, even when they aren't stupid by themselves, aren't done justice in the game. He also seems to have a certain aversion to traditional storytelling, or at least that is the impression I got. He isn't a bad writer, I liked Planescape: Torment a whole lot. But nowadays I think the game would have been much better if they weren't actively trying to do something different from what RPGs had done up to now.

About Pathfinder, I suppose it might be fun if you want to build your character like you build a M:tG deck. But if that is what it is aiming for, I think it could have done a better job by doing this and going all the way. I actually think a card based character build system could be interesting and fun, but even with traditional character building, you could have done something similar but without the use of cards and randomization. But if you want a traditional RPG, I don't usually care for having a whole lot of character classes (including several that are just a variation of magic user), I don't like having a whole lot of abilities that open up special actions for the character like several feats do, and I don't like the way 3e and its variants did magic items. Magic items in 2e were a whole lot more unique than how 3e did them. There are other things that bother me about Pathfinder, but hopefully these can give you an idea of why I don't like it.

 

[Iznaliu]

I don't usually care for having a whole lot of character classes (including several that are just a variation of magic user), I don't like having a whole lot of abilities that open up special actions for the character like several feats do,

So you hate variety and like blandness?

 

[Alex]

I don't usually care for having a whole lot of character classes (including several that are just a variation of magic user), I don't like having a whole lot of abilities that open up special actions for the character like several feats do,

So you hate variety and like blandness?

I like variety well enough. But I would rather not be pidgeon-holed into my character. Games where there are several different kinds of spellcasting classes usually try to make them different by giving them some slight different mechanics, but also by giving them a limited spell list, which is the opposite approach of how AD&D did it. Now, I think you could reply that in 3e (and Pathfinder by extension), the arcane spell list is still pretty big and varied, but I think the only reason that is so is because they couldn't do away with how the previous editions managed the class (4e tried that and the results weren't very good). The thing about this is that I would rather have my character become a summoner, for instance, by finding or researching the right spells throughout the game, rather than by taking levels in a summoner class that has a very predetermined way of dealing with how creatures are summoned. Worse yet,if there is a summoner class, it implies that what kind of spell you can research as a generic M.U. is limited otherwise you might begin stepping on the toes of the summoner. Consider, for instance, how all those item creation feats, metamagic feats and improved familiars and what not in 2e were simply spells you could learn. In fact, I think if you take the Wizard's Spell Compendium books from 2e, you will find an amount of variety there comparable to, if not greater than, the whole of the 3e edition, even with 3rd party products (maybe add in the GNSB as well?).

Another example is feats. In 3e, you have several feats open up special combat actions. I would much rather do this as GURPS do, where you could have these special actions, but using them would be simply an issue of practice. That is, if you want to do a "whirlwind attack", you can, but you will need to deal with a hefty penalty to your weapon skill. You could train that specific move, which would allow you to reduce this penalty (even to 0). This is much more interesting in my view because: 1) you don't have to deal with the weirdness of needing a level to attempt something. I don't dislike level based systems. But when mundane stuff is based on levels, they can become really weird, as in, your character can't take a few months to learn a new language, he needs to first get a new level. 2) The player is free to use his creativity. If whirlwind attack is an example of what is possible, rather than a feat, then the player could come up with several different moves for his own fighting style. 3) Games where a move is an important part of character building, instead of simply an example of how to use this or that skill, usually focus on making this character building important and shy away from allowing the PCs to circumvent those things. For instance, in a 3e game, killing the "boss" encounter by using the old illusory bridge trick could be seen as bad because the whole group was looking forward using the abilities they spent so much time choosing. Or course, this depends on your group, but a game like Pathfinder would more get in the way of this kind of play than help it.

 

[Wayward Son]

You do bring up valid points. I guess it comes down to a matter of that I enjoy it and am somewhat easily entertained (esp in PnP where a decent portion of the entertainment comes from the people you're playing with rather than solely from mechanics).

 

[Quantomas]

There is a chance that Pathfinder: Kingmaker will be more open in this respect, i.e. having feats that are not tied to character classes, because this is a logical way to implement the perks the kingdom buildings give you. This is just an educated guess based on the high number of feats the devs have announced and what they did in some of their previous games. But essentially it would allow you more creative freedom in the way you develop your character and kingdom, ideally both augmenting each other.