Eternity Pillars of Eternity II: Deadfire Pre-Release Thread [BETA RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

[Sizzle]

Playing a mage is still more fun in BG2 (because of a greater selection of various OP spells) than it is in PoE

For me the thing about BG2 mages isn't the OP spells, but the sheer range of effects you can do with them. Applies to BG2 casters in general. Finding synergies and abusing them is fun.

The Pillars magic system is pretty flat by comparison -- you combine status effects and hit vulnerable defences, but that's about it. There's nothing comparable to Wizard Eye, Glitterdust, or even Invisibility there.

Pull of Eora leads to interesting combos, actually.

That one and the tentacle summoning spell (Maura's Writhing Tentacles) added in TWM were, while not exactly OP (though both very useful), really fun to use.

A few more spells like that - I suppose memorable would be the right word to use - and the entire Wizard magic system would have looked and played a lot differently. It would probably still be too balance-y and a bit anemic compared to BG2, but you would get more of a sense of playing an actual powerful, smart mage with a big repertoire of spells that not only directly harm, but also hinder the enemies in interesting (and wacky) ways.

 

[Parabalus]

The Pillars magic system is pretty flat by comparison -- you combine status effects and hit vulnerable defences, but that's about it. There's nothing comparable to Wizard Eye, Glitterdust, or even Invisibility there.

They spread around the goodies to all the classes, that's why mages feel flat in comparison. Compare martial classes to their PoE equivalent and the IE ones suck in comparison. Problem is mages propped also propped up hybrids (dual/multi-classes), so they too feel flatish.

IIRC Sawyer mentioned somewhere specifically that for Deadfire one of the goals is for all classes to feel awesome, not just mages.

Most of the cool stuff mages did in BG2 was game breaking and exploiting the AI, or at least the AI couldn't do it to you, because of that I don't mind it being gone too much. PoE vancians are in a much healthier spot, but still op - that's why the switch to Power.

 

[FreeKaner]

muh wizards

 

[Sizzle]

muh wizards

In all honesty, I don't really mind the way Wizards turned out too much. It's just that so many people (here) associate the IE games with their robust and powerful magic system, that they felt the way PoE's Wizards were made was a letdown.

I still think it's amazing what PoE managed to do in a relatively short amount of time and on a small budget - a completely new ruleset, with 11 distinct classes, all of which play differently from one another.

For example, just take the differences between PoE's Ranger and Paladin and compare them to the differences between the Ranger and Paladin in the IE games. In the IE games, both of these classes are a variation of the core Fighter class - swap detect evil and some low-level cleric spells for more HP and weapon mastery and that's about it. But in PoE, all of these classes are distinct from one another - the Paladin has auras, exhortations, the Ranger comes with a permanent animal companion with which many of his abilities depend and synergize with.

 

[Prime Junta]

Oh, I like Pillars wizards. Especially the way you can build them so their weapon skills actually matter.

I don't even dislike Pillars magic overall. It's just that it's not (yet?) even close to BG2 magic. It needs more wacky stuff that does other things besides adjusting numbers with a special effect, like Pull of Eora.

 

[Lacrymas]

I don't get this "wizards aren't as grotesquely overpowered as in BG2, so PoE wizards suck" shtick. I don't want to be overpowered, I want to be challenged lolol. I dislike wizards in general because they are ridiculously banal at this point and I avoid playing them as a main PC, so maybe that's why I don't care if they are op or not. You can have fun and interesting spells without them breaking the game.

 

[Parabalus]

I don't even dislike Pillars magic overall. It's just that it's not (yet?) even close to BG2 magic. It needs more wacky stuff that does other things besides adjusting numbers with a special effect, like Pull of Eora.

That stuff has to be spread among all the classes, or otherwise you end up in the Bg2 situation where every non-wizard party member makes your party objectively weaker. That's what Sawyer wants to avoid and I applaud that notion. Even more important in PoE since it has no filler/junk classes like IE.

 

[Prime Junta]

every non-wizard party member makes your party objectively weaker

My ranger/cleric would like to amend that to "non-caster."

 

[Lacrymas]

Is ranger/cleric legal?

 

[Prime Junta]

Is ranger/cleric legal?

Is for half-elves. Stupidly OP too, you get both druid and cleric spells.

 

[Urthor]

wait how's that OP, you can still only cast one spell at a time and you don't get as many high level ones?

 

[Parabalus]

Is for half-elves. Stupidly OP too, you get both druid and cleric spells.

That bug is actually fixed, it correctly gives you spells up to your druid spell level (3 max).

Even with full lvl 7 druid spells they are worse than a x/mage though.

 

[Lacrymas]

Insect swarm or whatever the name was is a ridiculously good spell, it basically shuts down casters.

 

[Sentinel]

The Pillars magic system is pretty flat by comparison -- you combine status effects and hit vulnerable defences, but that's about it. There's nothing comparable to Wizard Eye, Glitterdust, or even Invisibility there.

They spread around the goodies to all the classes, that's why mages feel flat in comparison. Compare martial classes to their PoE equivalent and the IE ones suck in comparison. Problem is mages propped also propped up hybrids (dual/multi-classes), so they too feel flatish.

IIRC Sawyer mentioned somewhere specifically that for Deadfire one of the goals is for all classes to feel awesome, not just mages.

Most of the cool stuff mages did in BG2 was game breaking and exploiting the AI, or at least the AI couldn't do it to you, because of that I don't mind it being gone too much. PoE vancians are in a much healthier spot, but still op - that's why the switch to Power.

Mages never felt awesome in PoE, they were boring as fuck, and I don't see that changing. At least they haven't announced anything that gives me hope.

 

[ERYFKRAD]

Casters are shit anyway.

 

[Iznaliu]

Does this even matter since significant revisions are planned for PoE2?

 

[Sentinel]

All the magic revisions so far announced sound like they're a turn for the worse.

 

[Lacrymas]

What revisions specifically?

 

[Sentinel]

Removed vancian casting. I think that's the only thing they said so far.

 

[Sizzle]

 

[Lacrymas]

Removed vancian casting. I think that's the only thing they said so far.

Ah, that. Yeah. The way you phrased it, "ALL the magic revisions...", sounded like they've leaked more info that I wasn't aware of. I am willing to give them the benefit of the doubt regarding the change to resting, but I'm also ready for it to turn into an MMO spam fest which I despise.

 

[Infinitron]

Removed vancian casting. I think that's the only thing they said so far.

What. The Power Source system with spells that change and grow stronger as you level up, slower spellcasting, spell interruption and loss, these are huge revisions.

 

[Sentinel]

Removed vancian casting. I think that's the only thing they said so far.

What. The Power Source system with spells that change and grow stronger as you level up, slower spellcasting, spell interruption and loss, these are huge revisions.

Oh yeah. None of them sounded particularly good to me, so I just disregarded them.

 

[Sherry]

hi there!

it has been a busy month and I have not been as active as I would liek to be so the last update was sea shanty songs that will be original to the game and its regions kind of like the books we all read and enjoyed in Pillars rightg? there will be a lot of singing to be had as we sails around the sea plus a sea sahnty unlocked after a certain thingy happens that is what I am going to come out and say so I hope it happens because of a lot of what we discuss here has happened even with the lack of posts by some at obsidian who hang out here they still read so keep the suggestions c oming and help out!!

probablky kind of dumb with cannibals because would it be hidden from the player though righgt? Does a cannibal like a vegan and they tell you on the second conversation choice so you do or do not take them on your ship or does it just happen and as captain you have to figure out via a quest-line who is eating your crew? that would be kinda neat if there was a quest to catch cannibal-crew before they eat everyone and you become strandecd at sea. Can my barbarian/druid eat the crew? Can I get hungry and eat them. It should go both ways righgt?

"Hi my name is Crispy I am a cannibal can I join your crew anyway?"

makes me wonder how many players would be screwed if they were not told it was a cannonball and in the middle of sailing around your entire crew is eaten due to lack of food and does the coannonball eat normal food to blend in and just nbible on the crew when they can?

sailors ate one another due to conditions they encountered for survival it seams a little out of palce unless we are sailing in the open sea for weeks on end or get stuck in ice.

Thanks,
Sherry

 

[Ulfhednar]

cannonball

I your spelling!