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Just started "Operation Babel"; so far... much better than Abyss.

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aweigh

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ok, the dungeons are definitely better than the ones in SoSC. Game is finally beginning to reach a normal level of Wiz-quality. I guess my expectations for the "difficulty" were simply too high as I've been playing so much Elminage (literally...) and so much classic Wizardry as well (been re-playing through scenarios 1-5 but this time on Game Boy, as those remake versions for GBC feature extra items and a post-dungeon the SNES/PS 1 versions do not... !)-- that my barometer for what is "difficult" is askew.

yes, the game is easy. BUT.... it is not brain-dead easy, like Op. Abyss, and right now it's finally leveling into basically the same amount of "difficulty" as the original PC ver. of Code Hazard.

Right now I have to go clear the 2nd "abyss" dungeon that has appeared (basically they're plot-dungeons that come and go as required by the story and trigger after you complete some missions), and finally, finally, after like almost 8 hours clocked playing I ran into the first Variant Enemy that almost wiped me. (Mostly because I began the fight with auto-attack, heh).

Sub-classing's proving very fun, as mentioned, probably allows for way way way more broken builds than SoSC does since it has more freedom and it has more classes. Already my Fighter/Samurai is just ridiculously effective. I can easily imagine a party of 6 fighter/samurais rofl-stomping the campaign, heh.

I was gonna upload some more footage but too tired, instead I'll just answer your dungeon question with a pic from the JP wiki (short answer: yes, the dungeon design is good, probably the same quality as Code Hazard).

The game's biggest problem is that the first like 4 "dungeons" are all just tutorial sections with just unbearably endless text spam from the game's characters going blah blah every fucking 5 seconds. For a bit there I was legit worried this was some light novel bullshit.

EDIT: ok, a perfect example of why I say it has bullshit intro stuff... one of the first missions is they FORCE you to go to dev lab and use the crafting system...

yes, we know it's possible its your first game of this series. I get it. BUT WHY DOES IT HAVE TO BE UNSKIPABBLE!!! Just massive wastes of time in the first few hours of the Babel with you having to read shit you already know and doing shit you don't want to do.

tee-hee.
 

duanth123

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Sad to hear difficulty takes a dive later on, but not unexpected considering EXP inc's previous games. How's the dungeon design? Is it 'follow the corridor' like SoSC or mazey and dangerous?

Mazey and dangerous for several, not all.

Some of them are already fucking brutal, relatively speaking. I'm talking dark zones with spinners and no mapping, one way doors, and the occasional drop into another dungeon.

Boss fights are respectable with the Izith device (+3 levels.)

I would imagine even more difficult if you didn't put initial points into VIT. I put every single point for all chars into it until I was 20 on each.

aweigh, I would say if you're looking for a challenge, then don't use the Unity gauge. It trivializes some fights, like an unbalanced, unnecessary version of SoSC's.

EDIT: oh, btw, currently only my Academic is dual-classed (w/ Conjurer). I have Fighter/Paladin/Monk/Cleric/Bishop (the academic) and lastly a Mage.

Fighter would work well with Sam, Paladin works well with Assassin because of god speed and utsusemi (basically defense/evasion increases, more while defending), Monk with Assassin b/c assassins have 'deadly" which is basically a chance of instakill with bare fists, I chose Cleric with Paladin for defense because mine is front row, Academic with Mage because of the WIS synergy, and Mage with Cleric for the Mana recovery skill at higher tiers.
 
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aweigh

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goddamn fucking computer crashed at the end now i have to do that shit all over again. it ain't difficult just tedious, and annoying. i think games that don't allow saving for loooooooooooooooooooooong stretches, such as say... explring/mapping out entire dungeon floors, is quite retarded in the game design approach. shit happens and progress gets lost, and not being able to save doesn't make the game neither better, nor does it make it more interesting or more complex.

it just makes it obvious to the player the designers are japs with small wieners.
 

Jimmious

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Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
I just want to say that I don't play blobbers , japanese or otherwise, but reading aweigh's posts is more enjoyable than quite some games out there. You gotta love the passion. Keep it up bro.
 

Trash Player

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Jun 13, 2015
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Initially, I read aweigh's post to rack up my interest to play a blobber.
At this point, I have yet to really get into a blobber; I just become a stalker to aweigh...
:despair:
 

CryptRat

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Guys if you're intimidated by blobbers you can start by playing Paper Sorcerer. It's cheap, mostly about combat, with mostly handplaced (not random) encounters, with a small party, not that long, very good and you're supporting an indie developper in the process.
You can also download and play the demo of Swords & Sorcery : Underworld if you're that not sure. The game is a good classic blobber but with a fast pacing compared with many old ones, and once again it's made by some cool indie developper. And after playing the demo you'll probably want to buy the full game.
 
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Zetor

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Hmm, this thread is kinda sorta relevant to my interests -- Starcrawlers is making me want to play a more srs-bsns blobber again also, my butthurt disdain regarding Operation Abyss has cooled down somewhat

My biggest question is: how is the damage/defense inflation and how much flexibility is there in combat options? I found that the OG Code Hazard had a really good balance: HP and damage/defense values were low enough even in the endgame that even 'trash' fights were potentially deadly and hybrid classes could do a lot more than just spam their class ability over and over (it got even better with multiclassing, obv), and as a bonus it could keep older pieces of equipment relevant instead of just having to constantly upgrade gear like in some MMO. On the other side of things, Demon Gaze (and to some extent, SOSC) was all about making the party untouchable and nuking enemies with kazillion damage each turn, with each character doing pretty much the same thing over and over, even in boss fights for the most part... also, gear progression relied on deliberate (and for the most part, trivial) 'item farm' encounters, zzzz.
 

Shackleton

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Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Make the Codex Great Again! Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag. Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture
I'm still a bit too early to really answer that question tbh Zetor, but with the sub classes increasing the HP pool for chars even more than in Abyss even at this stage trash fights are very much, trash. Might change later but I doubt it.

However I am really liking the increased battle speed in this one, so those trash fights can literally be over inside 10 seconds. That might sound a bit weird to non-blobber fans, that you want the content to be over with quicker, but when it's just a dull trash encounter speed of completion is very much appreciated.

Got to agree with aweigh about the amount of bullshit text so far, even though I was expecting it I can't say I'm doing much more than bashing the 'skip' button. After starting off reading for it for a bit my capacity for cringe was reached very early on.

So far, decent but a bit dull. Like driving a 1.2 family saloon rather than a 3 litre sports coupe, which is pretty much what I expected.
 

Shackleton

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Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Make the Codex Great Again! Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag. Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture
Note to self: If an NPC asks 'are you ready?' and gives you a choice of yes or no, she's probably not asking if you've been to the toilet before you go. What is more likely is that a boss fight is on the way and unequipping your +mob level item, removing fear from your Academic and getting your HP up to max is going to be the way to go.

:dead:
First wipe and lesson learnt.
 

duanth123

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Finished the game...now for postgame.

Having both level-increase items equipped is a necessity for any sort of challenge.

Even then, only the last few bosses present a challenge.
 

Shackleton

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Codex 2016 - The Age of Grimoire Make the Codex Great Again! Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag. Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture
Still enjoying this, a lot more than Abyss. Think i'm approaching endgame, on the Cemetery and Facility dungeons and then only one more 7th Hand left.

I think a lot of this game's issues stem from Experience being afraid to go balls-out with challenge. Not just the mobs, as that depends very much on how much grinding you tend to do- but the basic issue of attrition in exploring the dungeons. You've always got more than enough resources so you never feel like you're pushing the envelope in exploring that little bit further. HP, Spells, inventory space, mobs that instant kill, none of these are ever an issue so the only time you want to go back is either to level up or to complete a wanted variant mission to stop him from popping again when you're grinding. Not that they're particularly hard, just annoying and not worth the little extra XP compared to a normal group you can just blitz through. Escaping a dungeon is always a given (so far) as the lvl 2 spell Return Gate gives you an out every time.

One map even has a section where you have to find some devices to activate and they give you a guide to take you straight to them. Yes, like the messages and the mob lvl+ devices they're optional, but as you never know when stuff will cross the line from challenging to annoying, if you know the option is there most people will use it.

I always think crawlers are better when you're pushed to the limit and trying to figure out how to wring that last few HP out or improve damage that little bit more so you can kill a bit more efficiently and get a little bit further in the dungeon or get back to a safe zone. Not when you're self limiting by not using some of the tools available put in to stop people raging on forums because they died and lost 30 minutes progress.

I'm enjoying it as I like the quick grinding and the 'grind-identify-level-craft' cycle, but it does all feel a bit humdrum. Maybe the postgame will be more difficult.
 
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aweigh

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that was very well said.

i'm alternating right now between StarCrawlers and Op. Babel, and while SC definitely is a more "fun" and "modern" experience it is ultimately much more hollow experience and after the initial honeymoon phase (which for me was around 4-6 dungeons in SC, 2 of them story-based and the others procedurally generated) it is quite apparent how a blobber lives or dies by the depth of its mechanical systems.

it is not enough to simply fit your blobber with the "standards" such as TB combat, classes, party management, etc. Each system must have some meat to it or the game begins to fall completely apart as blobbers aren't generally known for backing up their game play w/ "stories" and "interactions" to divvy the players attention/stimulation.

So, that said, I'm back again to 'crawling thru Op. Babel and what Shackleton says is p. much spot on. It is all really down to Exp. Inc. being too much of a pussy.

(That translates into: Exp. Inc. games outsell Starfish SD games 3-to-1 because, by being "pussies", Exp. Inc. games are given better review scores by gaming outlets and are consumed more readily by both casuals who can't into blobbers and by weeabos who think anime-chars flashing their panties constitutes a "story"; whereas Starfish SD games are given the "retro-ware" treatment by reviewers who can't understand why a game is challenging them and generally snubbed or simply ignored by casuals and weeabos alike because there aren't enough panties being flashed).

It's a sad state of affairs but at least there are TB blobbers coming out currently, and the big ones are getting localized into English, which is not something that was happening even as recently as 5 years ago.

...that's sumthin'.
 

hackncrazy

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Jun 9, 2015
Messages
415
I just want to say that I don't play blobbers , japanese or otherwise, but reading aweigh's posts is more enjoyable than quite some games out there. You gotta love the passion. Keep it up bro.

Aweigh's posts are one of the biggest reasons why I keep coming back to this forum.

The guy speaks with so much passion about blobbers that it makes even a popamole like me eager to play them, even though turn based combat is one of the worst thing that the humankind has created.
 

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