Putting the 'role' back in role-playing games since 2002.
Donate to Codex
Good Old Games
  • Welcome to rpgcodex.net, a site dedicated to discussing computer based role-playing games in a free and open fashion. We're less strict than other forums, but please refer to the rules.

    "This message is awaiting moderator approval": All new users must pass through our moderation queue before they will be able to post normally. Until your account has "passed" your posts will only be visible to yourself (and moderators) until they are approved. Give us a week to get around to approving / deleting / ignoring your mundane opinion on crap before hassling us about it. Once you have passed the moderation period (think of it as a test), you will be able to post normally, just like all the other retards.

From Software It's another Demon's Souls thread god damnit

sullynathan

Arcane
Joined
Dec 22, 2015
Messages
6,473
Location
Not Europe
You know, I ran into the false king earlier in my playthrough but left because of how low my damage was. It was a good boss.

I know what they were getting at with the ending.
 

Arnust

Savant
Joined
Dec 22, 2016
Messages
680
Location
Spain
Demon's really was hurt by never getting that DLC. Great game anyway, in some aspects of polish it often even outdoes DS1
 

Zed Duke of Banville

Dungeon Master
Patron
Joined
Oct 3, 2015
Messages
11,756
Demon's really was hurt by never getting that DLC. Great game anyway, in some aspects of polish it often even outdoes DS1
Perhaps for the 10th anniversary of the series in 2019, From Software can finally release a Demon's Souls expansion that repairs the broken Archstone leading to the Land of Giants. :M

And using the Archstone lets you play through Dark Souls in the Demon's Souls engine. +M
 

Ivan

Arcane
Joined
Jun 22, 2013
Messages
7,471
Location
California
in some aspects of polish it often even outdoes DS1
Like?

Demons Souls does dread far better than any other title of the series, only rivaled by Bloodborne. I think its "level" set-up helps it tremendously in achieving that. I don't remember which theme it was, but the level with the Old Monk, Shrine of Storms, and of course Latria, oh shit and Astraea are all exceptional moments.
 

Elwro

Arcane
Joined
Dec 29, 2002
Messages
11,746
Location
Krakow, Poland
Divinity: Original Sin Wasteland 2
Activating the shortcut in Latria lvl 2 was memorable partly because there was no bonfire between that and the start of the level. And you possibly had to fight an invasion on your way there... If Dark Souls was made in a similar way there'd be no 2nd bonfire in the Tomb of Giants or halfway through Blighttown. Would it be better? It would certainly make me be even more careful and learn the levels more studiously...
 
Last edited:

sullynathan

Arcane
Joined
Dec 22, 2015
Messages
6,473
Location
Not Europe
Demons Souls does dread far better than any other title of the series, only rivaled by Bloodborne. I think its "level" set-up helps it tremendously in achieving that. I don't remember which theme it was, but the level with the Old Monk, Shrine of Storms, and of course Latria, oh shit and Astraea are all exceptional moments.
Demons Souls music is better than Dark Souls 1 & 2 but I stop there, both Bloodborne and Souls 3 had better themes.
I don't know if it is my failing eyesight or the engine, but there are lots of places in Demons Souls that are dark and blurry and mask a fall.

Activating the shortcut in Latria lvl 2
are you talking about when you cause the giant thing to fall?
 
Last edited:

Elwro

Arcane
Joined
Dec 29, 2002
Messages
11,746
Location
Krakow, Poland
Divinity: Original Sin Wasteland 2
Activating the shortcut in Latria lvl 2
are you talking about when you cause the giant thing to fall?
I think so. It's when you loop back to the beginning of the level. I once took an hour I think to get there and just before I did that I locked on like an idiot to one of the flying enemies and, of course, fell to my death

edit: I thought you unlocked something there, but maybe you just drop down so that's not important. Sorry, my memory is hazy
 
Joined
Dec 12, 2015
Messages
150
Demons Souls does dread far better than any other title of the series, only rivaled by Bloodborne. I think its "level" set-up helps it tremendously in achieving that. I don't remember which theme it was, but the level with the Old Monk, Shrine of Storms, and of course Latria, oh shit and Astraea are all exceptional moments.
Demons Souls music is better than Dark Souls 1 & 2 but I stop there, both Bloodborne and Souls 3 had better themes.
I don't know if it is my failing eyesight or the engine, but there are lots of places in Demons Souls that are dark and blurry and mask a fall.

.

Didn't play Bloodborne, but Dark Souls 3 OST is shit compared to Demon's and Dark Souls. Demon's souls have better atmosphere, NPC's and is a more consistent package than Dark Souls. I think they are different expressions of the same brilliant mind, equally good but with distinct strengths
 

Vorark

Erudite
Joined
Mar 2, 2017
Messages
1,394
Ehh, the only DS3 track that grabbed my attention was the alternate one for the Shrine.

It's the one that plays when you make the deal with the Fire Keeper.
 

sullynathan

Arcane
Joined
Dec 22, 2015
Messages
6,473
Location
Not Europe
Demon's souls have better atmosphere
atmosphere is overrated. They both do the same thing with little music and drab environments

you sure?

more consistent package than Dark Souls
I disagree. Lost Izalith is a bad area but I still have no problem getting through it. I would much rather take Dark Souls and its expansion over everything in Demons Souls because it does everything better from combat to level design, bosses and multiplayer.

Even little things like removing item burden and handling leveling and upgrading through bonfire instead of constantly treading back to the Nexus is preferable. Matter of fact, the latter thing is one of the worst things the entire souls series after Dark Souls did, they took the Demons Souls approach of having a necessary central hub.

Dark Souls 3 OST is shit compared to Demon's and Dark Souls
Demons Souls has 1 or 2 notable pieces, Dark Souls 3 has at least 3- 5 while Dark Souls 1 only has 1 or 2.

I think so. It's when you loop back to the beginning of the level. I once took an hour I think to get there and just before I did that I locked on like an idiot to one of the flying enemies and, of course, fell to my death

edit: I thought you unlocked something there, but maybe you just drop down so that's not important. Sorry, my memory is hazy
You might be talking about the elevator after you find the assassin. There are three (or two) elevators that take your character all the way down to this bloody place, you get here after making one of the giant things hands to fall. Its one of the highlights of tower of latria.

There is a shortcut after making the giant thing fall down but it is a one way shortcut. It only happens after you've reached that part of latria.

Demon's really was hurt by never getting that DLC. Great game anyway, in some aspects of polish it often even outdoes DS1
Perhaps for the 10th anniversary of the series in 2019, From Software can finally release a Demon's Souls expansion that repairs the broken Archstone leading to the Land of Giants. :M

And using the Archstone lets you play through Dark Souls in the Demon's Souls engine. +M
A demons souls remake would be preferable.
 
Last edited:
Joined
Aug 10, 2012
Messages
5,869
I think fondly on Dark Souls because it was new back then, and not the hackneyed meme mega blockbuster series that it is today. It felt pretty exciting playing DeS at the time it came out. Even though DS3 might be the superior game, I couldn't stand playing it for more than an hour because the formula is so stale by now.

Ideally, From would go back to King's Field, but that will probably never happen.
 

sullynathan

Arcane
Joined
Dec 22, 2015
Messages
6,473
Location
Not Europe
On a more serious note, does anyone actually think Demons does anything better than Dark Souls and onward? When playing the newer games and going back to it, I didn't get this feeling of dread that Ivan mentioned. To an extent I sort of see why people think Dark Souls 3 is formulaic, once you've played these games a lot and seen the level design, enemy patterns and more somewhat repeated for 5 games it does become predictable.

Demons Souls ends up having the worst bosses and combat in the series just due to the fact that the later games improved heavily on bosses and combat. Just thinking about how every boss in the game has a very basic and limited moveset highlights the games weakness.

The game doesn't have an outright bad level, I'd even say that perhaps Valley of Defilement would have been better than Blighttown if it didn't have the shitty plague/poison floors with no way to move quickly through it like Blighttown. It hurts the 2nd area and the shitty ending boss fight.

The Shrine of storms ends up being the worst world in this game. Stupid skeletons and their stun locking reminds me of Dark Souls 3 but more sloppy. The shit mages that track you, the constant flying things that shoot you with their bad hit detection and the all round awful bosses in the world.

  • Stonefang Tunnel
  • Tower of Latria
  • Boletarian Palace

Would have ranked Valley there too but too much BS later on and lazy bosses.

In the bosses, I have
  • Penetrator
  • Maneater
  • Old King Allant
  • Flamelurker
The flamelurker will be readjusted in my NG+ playthrough. I killed him far too quickly so I didn't fully get his movesets or a challenge from him.

The Old King ends up being the most challenging boss because of his strong attacks and large moveset. I beat him first try but he was really fun to fight, he doesn't have delayed attacks like bosses in the later series but all his attacks follow with a gust of magic which does damage. I actually think this boss would have been better if the player didn't have so much healing too, it makes it somewhat trivial when you can just eat a piece of grass after every attack because you have so much.

Maneaters have a simple melee attack pattern but have a cool design, the claustrophobic fight location adds a bit of challenge to the fight since you can be knocked off.

In my playthrough, the penetrator was the first good boss.

On Balance, farming, armor and weapons, Demons Souls also handles this a bit different from the rest of the series. No armor upgrading is actually something I end up liking, no need to farm for that. At times the limited weaponry is likable because I don't have to spend time upgrading a large amount of weapons but at the same time unlike the later games there are weapons that are flatout just better than the rest. You Demonbrandt, Soulbrandt and your Blueblood sword are the best weapons I found and I've also learned that its possible to fuse Demonbrandt and Soulbrandt together.

Now, farming is a bigger pain in this game than Souls 1 - 3. About as annoying as bloodborne. Having to go back to the nexus over and over with long loading times is annoying and boring, and also most enemies give really low amount of souls in this game which is really weird. Since the game has a perishable healing system, I ended up having to farm which is shit. I will admit that it got better once I got gud.

I beat the game at less than lvl 70 which was far lower than any other souls game (DS1 - lvl 110+, DS2 - lvl 200+, BB lvl 100+, DS3 120+). Maybe its just me complaining but it was rather odd.
 
Joined
Aug 10, 2012
Messages
5,869
This sort of retroactive dissecting doesn't work. People remember the game fondly because it was something new and fresh at the time for them, you don't need to overthink it.

I still think Flamelurker is the best boss in the entire series, but that has nothing to do with movelist/mechanics/difficulty and everything to do with how I perceived the fight at the time - it had an impact, the music was great, I died a lot, etc. In retrospect, going back to it with all the accumulated knowledge of over a thousand hours in the whole series, it would probably be a lame fight, but who cares?

This is precisely why I think this sort of marathoning through any given series is a bad approach. You can't really appreciate what made games special without proper context and with excessive focus on mechanics.
 

sullynathan

Arcane
Joined
Dec 22, 2015
Messages
6,473
Location
Not Europe
I still think Flamelurker is the best boss in the entire series, but that has nothing to do with movelist/mechanics/difficulty and everything to do with how I perceived the fight at the time - it had an impact, the music was great, I died a lot, etc. In retrospect, going back to it with all the accumulated knowledge of over a thousand hours in the whole series, it would probably be a lame fight, but who cares?
I don't think it's a lame fight, I actually think it's one of the 4 good bosses in Demons Souls. I just think it was rather easy because when I fought it, I had Bastard Sword +7 with light weapon magic on it and with the messages players provided, I used a flame resistance ring. The thing is that, it was rather easy. The only boss in the game I died a lot too was the Fool's Idol, a boss that people say is one of the easiest.

I do not deny that the game is special since it did birth the souls series and is still pretty competent but I do believe Dark Souls was better. Given the 2 year difference between Demons Souls and Dark Souls release ,I'd say Dark is more impressive and huge improvement now looking back at it.
 
Joined
Dec 12, 2015
Messages
150
atmosphere is overrated. They both do the same thing with little music and drab environments

It's not man, it's a crucial factor in the immersion.

you sure?

Yes, Maiden in Black is the best waifu in the series, and there are others memorable npcs like Ostrava and Stockpile Thomas. Only cared about Solaire in Dark Souls.


I disagree. Lost Izalith is a bad area but I still have no problem getting through it. I would much rather take Dark Souls and its expansion over everything in Demons Souls because it does everything better from combat to level design, bosses and multiplayer.

The problem is that the second half of the game contradicts almost everything that made the first great. That's why Dark Souls 3 is shit, because it took the worst aspect of the first and made a whole game of it.


Even little things like removing item burden and handling leveling and upgrading through bonfire instead of constantly treading back to the Nexus is preferable. Matter of fact, the latter thing is one of the worst things the entire souls series after Dark Souls did, they took the Demons Souls approach of having a necessary central hub.

Thought item burden was nice, carrying the world world in your bag never made sense to me.


Demons Souls has 1 or 2 notable pieces, Dark Souls 3 has at least 3- 5 while Dark Souls 1 only has 1 or 2.

Nah, i barely remember any track of Dark Souls 3 outside of the main theme, that is great i recon. There are several memorable themes in both Dark and Demon's Souls: Phalanx, Tower Knight, Penetrator(Vanguard), Adjucator, Allant, Maneaters, Flamelurker, Bad ending theme and especially Maiden Astraea; Taurus Demon, Bell Gargoyles, Iron Golem, S&O, Artorias, Four Kings, etc.

And i played Dark Souls 3 last year.

I think fondly on Dark Souls because it was new back then, and not the hackneyed meme mega blockbuster series that it is today. It felt pretty exciting playing DeS at the time it came out. Even though DS3 might be the superior game, I couldn't stand playing it for more than an hour because the formula is so stale by now.

Pretty sure it's the worst. That's why you couldn't play.
 
Last edited:

sullynathan

Arcane
Joined
Dec 22, 2015
Messages
6,473
Location
Not Europe
Yes, Maiden in Black is the best waifu in the series, and there are others memorable npcs like Ostrava and Stockpile Thomas. Only cared about Solaire in Dark Souls.
You see, I don't care about waifus or anything of that matter. Even stockpile Thomas is unimportant to me. The bonfire from dark souls took care of both their positions in a more effective way.

Thought item burden was nice, carrying the world world in your bag never made sense to me.
There are lots of things that don't make sense in fantasy games, in this instance I still prefer no item burden.
 

sullynathan

Arcane
Joined
Dec 22, 2015
Messages
6,473
Location
Not Europe
Playing through NG+ now, holy shit. Did you know there was a shortcut to get to the flame lurker? I never tried that area throughout my first playthrough
 
Joined
Dec 12, 2015
Messages
150
Played the game today after like an year, yeah, despite being 30FPS, i still think it has the best "feel" of the series, Dark Souls 3 and Bloodborne aside because they're current gen; it's fast paced but not too much, just the sweet spot.
 

Zed Duke of Banville

Dungeon Master
Patron
Joined
Oct 3, 2015
Messages
11,756
Demons Souls music is better than Dark Souls 1 & 2 ...
Yes, I'm not sure which choice you made in the ending of Demon's Souls, but although the conventional ending yields "Return to Slumber", which is similar to the ending music later used in Dark Souls ("Nameless Song 1") and Dark Souls 2 ("Longing"), and like those other two is one of the better Souls tracks, if you
choose the "evil" ending by killing the Maiden in Black, then you're rewarded with "One Who Craves Souls", which is the single best piece of music in all the Souls series.
 

sullynathan

Arcane
Joined
Dec 22, 2015
Messages
6,473
Location
Not Europe
I didn't know there were multiple endings. I just went on ahead and fought the king in his shit form.

I'm playing NG+. I've already beat the Flamelurker and dragon God.
The game is going far more smoothly this playthrough. Stonefang really is the best area in the game, there are secrets in it that I didn't find before. I got Gut's sword this time, I found a 2nd elevator to an area I didn't know existed and I found a very quick shortcut to the Flamelurker. It easily allows me to beat the level at my own pace.


The Flamelurker was also a pretty good boss this. He has a good moveset and his extra fire explosion can easily catch one off guard.

The dragon God is a tricky one. This time I followed his face and saw that it is possible to know when and where he'll attack but even then, some of his fireballs are bullshit.

I fought the tower knight this time with no magic cheese. Surprisingly faster and more efficient. Sprinting to his legs don't take much time, I was actually surprised that him falling over causes you to take damage.

I also tried killing the red dragon but was unsuccessful. My bolts from my crossbow weren't hitting it at all.
 
Joined
Dec 12, 2015
Messages
150
So you cheesed the Tower Knight the first time?

:killit:

No wonder you didn't like the game.
 

As an Amazon Associate, rpgcodex.net earns from qualifying purchases.
Back
Top Bottom