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Torment Torment: Tides of Numenera Beta Thread [GAME RELEASED, GO TO NEW THREAD]

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From what I've read, about the length of the game, the main campaign is about 25 hours.
But there are so many side-quests, Dialog and places to explore that it's suppose to be much more longer that 25 hours...

But, i'll know the truth only after i'll play the full game...

P.S. Tyranny was claimed to be a short game. But, I finished him after 75 hours (did all the side-quests) - so it turned up to be NOT THAT SHORT.
I expect the game to be as long as Pillars since they took so much time to release it. I don't mind Tyranny because it was made in a short time and with a different scope but PS:T for example it could take you months to finish because like in the great adventure games of that time you had to figure out what to do. In TTON you get all the information in the journal.
 
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I expect the game to be as long as Pillars since they took so much time to release it.
TToN doesn't have trash mobs and the number of battles (crises) during the game is strictly limited. It's obviously it can't be as long as PoE.
no, but it has turned based combat, that alone should make the game longer to beat. I don't know what to say, we shall see when the game hits final release on Tuesday, but I really hope for it to be good.
I expect the game to have bugs and not get more then 8 out of 10 from most of the magazines, but at least to be much better then Mass Effect Andromeda. BTW I don't think it's such a good idea to release it near Andromeda.
 

FeelTheRads

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the main storyline so far in his game (until right after "the Bloom") is quite linear and you're only allowed to affect the outcome of sidequests basically.

So it's like Planescape: Torment

By the way, what am I supposed to do with this piece of information? No, really. I noticed the usual retards have been greatly amused by it, but I don't see it.
It seems like you're stuck in some kind of defensive loop and this is the only thing you can say.
- Portraits suck!
- They're not good in PST either!

- Combat sucks!
- So it does in PST!

- Story is linear!
- Like in PST!

Really, WHAT should I do with this? Should I learn something from it? Is it a life lesson? An anecdote? Do you think you're revealing some unknown information for the first time in history? What? Am I supposed to go "Yeah, man, you're totally right! I had forgotten that combat sucks in PST! Thank you, I understand that therefore it's OK, no, even GREAT that is sucks in TTON too!"?
 
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Infinitron

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Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
How come illiterate morons such as this one even get review copies?

It's possible that he didn't. Is there anything in that video that indicates that he's actually played the entire game?

It seems like you're stuck in some kind of defensive loop and this is the only thing you can say.
- Portraits suck!
- They're not good in PST either!

- Combat sucks!
- So it does in PST!

- Story is linear!
- Like in PST!

Eh. Personally, I don't think these things are the same. PS:T and T:ToN being linear isn't something that "sucks", like bad art or bad combat. It's okay for games to be linear.
 

AwesomeButton

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PC RPG Website of the Year, 2015 Make the Codex Great Again! Grab the Codex by the pussy Insert Title Here RPG Wokedex Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag. Pathfinder: Wrath
You're right. I closed the tab as soon as I heard "Planetscape".

On the topic of discussion:
- Unquestionably, short games are always worse than long games. Indisputably.
- Please remind me if PST was linear or not, and did it suffer from it?
 

FeelTheRads

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Eh. Personally, I don't think these things are the same. PS:T and T:ToN being linear isn't something that "sucks", like bad art or bad combat. It's okay for games to be linear.

Nice dodge.
Next time someone asks me how I'm doing, I will answer with "so is your wife".
 
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You're right. I closed the tab as soon as I heard "Planetscape".

On the topic of discussion:
- Unquestionably, short games are always worse than long games. Indisputably.
- Please remind me if PST was linear or not, and did it suffer from it?
It was linear in the end of the game. Pretty sure TTON will handle things differently and will be more opened. I already like it more because you don't have to fight every battle. Also the fact that it's Sci-fi gets my hopes up. I really loved the Early Access game, playing right now because I can continue with the full game. Did you know that you can actually play the fight with the Sorrow fragments from the early beta in the latest update?
Also if you keep your characters waiting they will comment about it :)
 

Infinitron

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Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
Compared to the other two games in the traditional Codex holy trinity, Fallout and Arcanum, PS:T is linear from beginning to end. It was common for oldschool Codexers to criticize it for this.
 

Infinitron

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Codex Year of the Donut Serpent in the Staglands Dead State Divinity: Original Sin Project: Eternity Torment: Tides of Numenera Wasteland 2 Shadorwun: Hong Kong Divinity: Original Sin 2 A Beautifully Desolate Campaign Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Pathfinder: Kingmaker Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
https://www.forbes.com/sites/kevinm...orment-tides-of-numenera-engaging-the-player/

The George Ziets Interview Part 3: Writing For 'Torment: Tides Of Numenera', Engaging The Player


Torment: Tides of Numenera. Credit: InXile

George Ziets is the Lead Area Designer for InXile's RPG Torment:Tides of Numenera. He graciously consented to devote a good deal of his time to this four-part interview about the video game writer's job and the special challenges and opportunities of writing Torment. The interview took place through email and has been edited for comprehension.

Ziets received a Masters degree in Cognitive Psychology with an emphasis on Human-Computer Interaction in 1999. (Disclosure. I was a member of his thesis committee.) In 2001 he took a job writing dialog for the MMO Earth & Beyond. Since then he has held various positions as a writer, designer or creative lead on games such as Lord of the Rings Online, Dungeons & Dragons Online, Neverwinter Nights 2, Elder Scrolls Online, Dungeon Siege 3, Fallout: New Vegas and Torment among others.

Minor spoilers follow.

Kevin Murnane: Torment:Tides of Numenera takes place in a strange and mysterious world that is unlike anything seen in video games since the original Planescape: Torment. Did this place more of an emphasis on writing during game development because of the need to make such a different world understandable and interesting to the player?


George Ziets: The focus on writing was a major feature of Torment from the start. Our Kickstarter backers supported our crowd-funding campaign because they loved the writing in the original game. No matter what setting we chose, we wanted great writing to take center stage.

If anything, we chose the Numenera setting because it makes an ideal showcase for the writing. It was developed by Monte Cook Games as a setting where players could focus more on narrative and less on complicated game mechanics. Additionally, the setting is full of strange and unusual things. It takes place a billion years in the future, where countless civilizations have risen and fallen, leaving behind their wildly advanced technology. This meant that nothing was off-limits, and every character could be unique, bizarre, and memorable. As writers, we loved it. We got to indulge our imaginations and explore the wildest frontiers of science fantasy.


Torment: Tides of Numenera. Credit: InXile

Murnane: Torment’s world is fascinating but it can also be overwhelming, at least initially, because very little is familiar. Is this something the writing team was aware of, and if so, how did you go about easing the new player into the game?


Ziets: This was definitely a challenge. When players enter our world, a lot of elements will be unfamiliar – the setting, the story, and even parts of the gameplay system. We iterated quite a bit to find the best way to introduce them all… without overwhelming the player.

Our earliest versions of the introduction dropped a ton of information about the world and the story on players. After testing it internally, we realized that it was just too much. So we dialed it back, removing almost all the background about the world and focusing on the most important elements of the player’s story instead.

As for easing the player into the world – we decided to let that proceed more organically. The player’s first real look at the world of Numenera is the Reef of Fallen Worlds, a reef of ancient structures that surrounds the starting city. It’s a wild profusion of weird artifacts and technology from different eras, designed to show the extent of the strangeness in this world. Once the player enters the city, they’ll encounter more unusual characters and technology, and they can ask questions and gradually find out more about the setting. We wanted to leave questions about the world unanswered at the beginning to give the player mysteries to investigate.

We also altered the Numenera rules to make things feel a little more familiar. For example, we added the health bar, which doesn’t exist in the tabletop game. We made additional changes to other systems so that they’d work better in a video game and feel a little more familiar to most gamers.


Torment: Tides of Numenera. Credit: InXile

Murnane: How do you ground the player in enough that is familiar so that he or she can identify with the game's main character, the Last Castoff, in such an unfamiliar world?


Ziets: One thing we did was to make the main character a newborn being. Even though their body has been occupied by someone else for a number of years, the main character’s consciousness is born at the start of the game, and they don’t know much about the setting. Thus, it makes perfect sense for the player to be asking basic questions of NPCs, and we provide many opportunities to explore and understand the world. The player’s companions help too. Most of them are aware that the player is newly born, and they interject with their opinions about the world and its inhabitants.

Another important strategy when working in an unfamiliar setting is to make sure that characters have believable human motivations. They might be living in the guts of a giant amoeboid monster (the Bloom), but their core hopes and desires are still emotionally believable to players. If players can connect with characters on an emotional level, they’ll usually embrace the setting, no matter how unfamiliar it seems.


Torment: Tides of Numenera. Credit: InXile

Murnane: Torment’s world is outside the box which can encourage players to think outside the box as they immerse themselves in the game. Did this provide special challenges for handling the need to accommodate player agency in telling Torment’s story?


Ziets: It sure did. We committed to a lot of reactivity on Torment. We gave players multiple ways to solve every problem, and we provided unique and interesting consequences whenever possible. But because the world of Numenera is so unusual, and because we created so many strange artifacts with powerful abilities, we had to account for all the unexpected ways players might try to resolve a situation.

Designers and writers are usually too close to their own creations to provide truly objective feedback, so we relied on other team members – and our external testing team – to play the quests and dialogues and find all the possibilities we may have missed. Then we did our best to account for all the edge cases. Some will be experienced by very few players, but we wanted to reward all the player’s choices, even the most unlikely ones. Players who discover those edge cases will feel like they’ve found a secret known only to a few.

[We made a strong] commitment to giving the player lots of choices and consequences. We embraced branching and interconnected quests to an extent that the vast majority of games wouldn't, so we had to account for many more paths through the content, which was a challenge... but well worth the effort for this kind of game, I think.

This is the third of a four-part interview
Torment: Tides of Numenera releases on PC, PS4 and Xbox One on Tuesday, February 28.
 

Perkel

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It is good that game releases in 2 days. I was on purpose not looking at news, read or watch anything related to this game to get that first proper play-trough without any bias.

I am just hopeful that it will reach or get close to PST like Mask of Betrayer did. Hopefully this game will join that exclusive club.
 

StaticSpine

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George Ziets: The focus on writing was a major feature of Torment from the start. Our Kickstarter backers supported our crowd-funding campaign because they loved the writing in the original game. No matter what setting we chose, we wanted great writing to take center stage.

If anything, we chose the Numenera setting because it makes an ideal showcase for the writing. It was developed by Monte Cook Games as a setting where players could focus more on narrative and less on complicated game mechanics. Additionally, the setting is full of strange and unusual things. It takes place a billion years in the future, where countless civilizations have risen and fallen, leaving behind their wildly advanced technology. This meant that nothing was off-limits, and every character could be unique, bizarre, and memorable. As writers, we loved it. We got to indulge our imaginations and explore the wildest frontiers of science fantasy.

:negative:
 
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We also altered the Numenera rules to make things feel a little more familiar. For example, we added the health bar, which doesn’t exist in the tabletop game. We made additional changes to other systems so that they’d work better in a video game and feel a little more familiar to most gamers.
:negative:

Those decline questions....Each one of them is like "OMG is this game not difficult for us, simpletons?"
 
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Darth Roxor

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the only people who feel negative about the above are people who have no idea how fucking shitty the pnp numederpa system is

or tards who for some reason actually find the numederpa system enjoyable
 

Urthor

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Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire
Numenera is honestly not pad in pnp, it's just stone cold retarded that you would use it for a video game.
 
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By the way, what am I supposed to do with this piece of information? No, really. I noticed the usual retards have been greatly amused by it, but I don't see it.
It seems like you're stuck in some kind of defensive loop and this is the only thing you can say.
- Portraits suck!
- They're not good in PST either!

- Combat sucks!
- So it does in PST!

- Story is linear!
- Like in PST!

Really, WHAT should I do with this? Should I learn something from it?

The real discussion is not about whether ToN has some of the same problems of PS:T, but whether ToN has what made PS:T special in the first place, namely, the sense that game exploration and companions are part of an experience of self-discovery and suspicion because the gameplay is tied to an excellent narrative premise. If ToN doesn’t have this feature, it is not a spiritual successor of PS:T.
 

Turjan

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the only people who feel negative about the above are people who have no idea how fucking shitty the pnp numederpa system is

or tards who for some reason actually find the numederpa system enjoyable
I never looked at Numenera (the pnp system) itself, but this is true. It's really hard to translate rules-light pnp systems, which ultimately rely on the ad hoc decisions of a human GM, into a computer game.
 

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