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Stellaris - Paradox new sci-fi grand strategy game

coldcrow

Prophet
Patron
Joined
Mar 6, 2009
Messages
1,650
Stellaris fanboys deliver on steam forum. OP was about meaningless endgame and would like to see added victory conditions. Perceiving an attack on their beloved pdox, come to the rescue: link

blurps:
"the engine is VERY VERY VERY open for modding, and they usually don't have huge budgets. what they gave us is what they were able to do without breaking a good portion of the game...that's up to the modders." modders will fix it
"In fact, I'd rather they take out victory conditions entirely. This is a Paradox game, after all, not just another generic 4x." :retarded:
"If you need a victory screen to validate your game experience, perhaps Paradox games are not your niche. These games are niche, and cater to gamers who prefer role play and individual goal-setting." There. pdox makes rpgs.
"On the contrary, every single time I play Stellaris it's a new experience, because I am telling a new story that can go in so many unexpected directions." :negative:

Etc.
 

Destroid

Arcane
Joined
May 9, 2007
Messages
16,628
Location
Australia
You can make the AI's advantages your advantages if you subjugate them and demand tribute, and they have to pay it out of their massive hax income.

This is an issue in a few games. Maybe they should give the AI discounts instead of bonuses.
 
Joined
Jan 7, 2012
Messages
14,153
You can make the AI's advantages your advantages if you subjugate them and demand tribute, and they have to pay it out of their massive hax income.

This is an issue in a few games. Maybe they should give the AI discounts instead of bonuses.

It's not at all unusual. In Civ you trade resources and techs for inflated values (nevermind tech trading which obviously relies on an AI that can research stuff before you do). Dunno if its been patched yet for Stellaris but you used to be able to trade sensors and research agreements for a decent lump sum with everyone you found.

It's in other games too, in EU you can bully every minor on the map for hundreds of gold each on higher difficulties.
 

thesheeep

Arcane
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Joined
Mar 16, 2007
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Tampere, Finland
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Stellaris fanboys deliver on steam forum. OP was about meaningless endgame and would like to see added victory conditions. Perceiving an attack on their beloved pdox, come to the rescue: link

blurps:
"the engine is VERY VERY VERY open for modding, and they usually don't have huge budgets. what they gave us is what they were able to do without breaking a good portion of the game...that's up to the modders." modders will fix it
"In fact, I'd rather they take out victory conditions entirely. This is a Paradox game, after all, not just another generic 4x." :retarded:
"If you need a victory screen to validate your game experience, perhaps Paradox games are not your niche. These games are niche, and cater to gamers who prefer role play and individual goal-setting." There. pdox makes rpgs.
"On the contrary, every single time I play Stellaris it's a new experience, because I am telling a new story that can go in so many unexpected directions." :negative:

Etc.
It's not all wrong, though.
I mean, what do you need a victory screen for? It's quite true you set your own goals in their games. True for EU, Vicky, CK, HoI...
Those games just have an end date, at which point you get a score assigned, but usually those scores have little to do with goals you set for yourself.
Does Stellaris have an "end date", though?

And quite frankly, I usually stop playing once I perceive my goal fulfilled.
I'm certainly not opposed to some actual conditions within the game rules, but I don't see why it is necessary.

End-game sucking is pretty much a given in most games with blobbing as you just become unstoppable or get somehow locked in a position you can't get out of.
It's not a great thing, but I haven't really seen this problem solved.
 

Nahel

Arcane
Joined
Feb 12, 2015
Messages
862
Alpha centauri had an interesting end game, due to the dangerosity of certain technology and units. It should be the same here but they lack creativity.
 

Space Satan

Arcane
Vatnik
Joined
May 13, 2013
Messages
6,216
Location
Space Hell
Alpha Centauri end game was very bad. 90% ofthe time you fought endless mindworms and rest of 10% was divided to 5% building and 5% diplomacy. I always discard diplomacy because meddling with mindworms AND factions was too time consuming without any significant profit.
 
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kris

Arcane
Joined
Oct 27, 2004
Messages
8,836
Location
Lulea, Sweden
I hadn't played the game much, so now that I started a new game on "Hard" I was almost shocked how much the AI must cheat. I had 25 planets, the AI 7. My fleet was capped, but the AI fleet was 250% stronger than mine. Even if I could easily rebuild mine, it would be pointless going into battle as i would hardly inflict any losses on them.

Was it 250% stronger in fleet power, or fleet cap? Because the former would indicate that - aside from cheating - they may have also built up a tech lead due to less research cost inflation due to number of controlled planets.

fleet power. they white peaced me after i burned some of their starports, I was quite impressed actually that the AI recognised that it wasn't winning despite still having a stronger fleet. (or maybe the AI just send a random peace offer)
 

Ventessel

Literate
Joined
Jan 25, 2017
Messages
36
It's not all wrong, though.
I mean, what do you need a victory screen for? It's quite true you set your own goals in their games. True for EU, Vicky, CK, HoI...
Those games just have an end date, at which point you get a score assigned, but usually those scores have little to do with goals you set for yourself.
Does Stellaris have an "end date", though?

And quite frankly, I usually stop playing once I perceive my goal fulfilled.
I'm certainly not opposed to some actual conditions within the game rules, but I don't see why it is necessary.

End-game sucking is pretty much a given in most games with blobbing as you just become unstoppable or get somehow locked in a position you can't get out of.
It's not a great thing, but I haven't really seen this problem solved.
Stellaris really got me thinking about this problem in 4X games, especially of the "conquer the galaxy" variety.

I think that the best solution to late game stagnation is via robust internal faction politics and through economic systems that give players something to do with their resources other than fight each other (i.e. if you have internal problems that need to be addressed to placate the population you may come to rely on trade rather than conquest).

Most 4X games model what amounts to ancient Mesopotamian diplomacy. Empire A has an alliance with Empire B until they conquer Empire C, and then they squabble.

There is no ability in these games to really model anything more complex, although with vassal states and the like modern games can roughly approximate Rome and her "allies", but there is nothing really like the Concert of Europe, or a way to create things like the Warsaw Pact or NATO, much less the EU. Federations had a lot of promise, but it seemed to just evaporate into so much hype as the mechanics were shallow and ultimately frustrating.

Sent from my SM-T350 using Tapatalk
 

Trash

Pointing and laughing.
Joined
Dec 12, 2002
Messages
29,683
Location
About 8 meters beneath sea level.
It's not all wrong, though.
I mean, what do you need a victory screen for? It's quite true you set your own goals in their games. True for EU, Vicky, CK, HoI...
Those games just have an end date, at which point you get a score assigned, but usually those scores have little to do with goals you set for yourself.
Does Stellaris have an "end date", though?

And quite frankly, I usually stop playing once I perceive my goal fulfilled.
I'm certainly not opposed to some actual conditions within the game rules, but I don't see why it is necessary.

End-game sucking is pretty much a given in most games with blobbing as you just become unstoppable or get somehow locked in a position you can't get out of.
It's not a great thing, but I haven't really seen this problem solved.
Stellaris really got me thinking about this problem in 4X games, especially of the "conquer the galaxy" variety.

I think that the best solution to late game stagnation is via robust internal faction politics and through economic systems that give players something to do with their resources other than fight each other (i.e. if you have internal problems that need to be addressed to placate the population you may come to rely on trade rather than conquest).

Most 4X games model what amounts to ancient Mesopotamian diplomacy. Empire A has an alliance with Empire B until they conquer Empire C, and then they squabble.

There is no ability in these games to really model anything more complex, although with vassal states and the like modern games can roughly approximate Rome and her "allies", but there is nothing really like the Concert of Europe, or a way to create things like the Warsaw Pact or NATO, much less the EU. Federations had a lot of promise, but it seemed to just evaporate into so much hype as the mechanics were shallow and ultimately frustrating.

Sent from my SM-T350 using Tapatalk

Check out EU: Rome. The game did internal problems right by making you care about and try to balance the ambitions of your political class. Not only did the game provide these hurdles, it also gave you the tools to try and combat them. It's also one of the few games to make the late game that more interesting by having to carefully monitor your own people.

Other than that I'm missing a UN in games like this. Sanctions, political dealing, new alliances and large decisions that might even shape the galaxy in it. Alpha Centauri had a version that worked splendidly and that had a marked impact on the playing field. Give me more of that.
 

Jimmious

Arcane
Patron
Joined
May 18, 2015
Messages
5,132
Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag.
That is where they are heading to with 1.5 and the new expansion. Internal politics, castes etc
 

Grotesque

±¼ ¯\_(ツ)_/¯
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Vatnik
Joined
Apr 16, 2012
Messages
8,987
Divinity: Original Sin Divinity: Original Sin 2
Hello everyone and welcome to another Stellaris development diary. Today's dev diary is going to be about psionics and one of the three ascension paths mentioned in Dev Diary #56: the Psionic Ascension Path.

Psionics
First, before we start digging into the way psionics will work Utopia, we should clarify that we are not removing any features from the free version of the game. If you have the Banks update but do not own Utopia, psionics will continue to work the same way they currently do: As technologies that you unlock. The only difference is that psionics can now only be researched by Spiritualist empires, though it is entirely possible for an empire that does not start out as Spiritualist to acquire psionics by shifting their empire ethics to Spiritualist over the course of the game, and once you start down the Psionic path it is possible to continue along it even if you stop being Spiritualist. This Spiritualist requirement applies whether or not you own Utopia.

If you *do* own the Utopia expansion, most of the psionic features will no longer appear as technologies. Only Psionic Theory, the very first psionic tech, is still researchable. To get access to the rest of the psionic path you will need to pick the 'Mind over Matter' Ascension Perk to start your empire on the Psionic Ascension Path. Picking this Ascension Perk will unlock latent psionic abilities among your primary species. A certain percentage of your leaders will have the 'Psychic' trait that grants a variety of advantages for the different leader classes, you will get access to Psionic Armies and also the special Psi Corps building. As with all Ascension Paths, you will need to have at least two Ascension Perk slots unlocked to pick 'Mind over Matter'.
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After picking Mind over Matter, you will need to continue amassing Unity and working your way through the Tradition trees. Once you have unlocked your fourth Ascension Perk slot, the 'Transcendance' Ascension Perk becomes available. This is the second stage in the Psionic Ascension Path and represents the full Psionic awakening of your species. From this point on, your entire species will get the 'Psionic' species trait and all leaders from this species will be full-fledged Psychics. In addition to the advantages granted by these traits, from now on there is also a chance that other species in your empire will psionically awaken, first as latent Psychics and then as fully awakened ones much like your own.
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The Shroud (Paid Feature)
Not long after fully awakening, your species will become aware of The Shroud. The Shroud is the realm from which psychics draw their power, a strange dimension very unlike the material universe, a place of opportunity and danger alike. To begin exploring The Shroud, you will need to complete a special society research project that once completed will give you access to The Shroud in the contacts view. Each time you wish to enter The Shroud you will need to expend a considerable amount of energy (in the form of Energy Credits), though this cost can be reduced by having access to the Zro Dust Strategic Resource.
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As for what can happen while exploring The Shroud... quite a few different things. We will not give them all away here, but some examples include unlocking psionic technologies, asking the spirits that dwell there for a boon, or even forming a Covenant with one of a number of particularly powerful spirits... a pact that will give great benefits, but may come at a terrible cost.
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That's all for today! Next week we'll be coming back to Factions and how you can use them to change your Empire Ethics. We'll also be talking about Indoctrination. See you then!
 

a cut of domestic sheep prime

Guest
So revisiting Stellaris now. Not for the aforementioned stealth-beta, but to see what modders have come up with.

This one is pretty kewl:

It's the standalone version of a larger mod (ISB: Balance). I'm actually using the larger mod, but this has an easier to read description of some of the cooler parts.

http://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=720237457
Improved Space Battles - expand your mid / late game with 5 new super-capital class ships, over 50 new technologies and 11 doomsday weapons - including planet destroying, star system destroying and anti-fleet super-weapons.

Anti-Fleet Superweapon:


It can take out 50K of ships in a single shot:


A Super-Carrier that replicates destroyer-sized autonomous drones:


A Planet-Destroyer:


And of course, a literal Star-Destroyer:


Also:
Doomsday Weapons
  • Deployed by either Titans or Avatars, these weapons of mass destruction allow you to annihilate enemy planets and populations at a cost.

  • Evolutionary Virus
  • Neutronium Kinetic Bombardment
  • Nanite Disassemblers
  • Nanite Deconstructors
  • Mind Control Stimulants
  • Primal Mutation
  • Forced Assimilation
 

Tigranes

Arcane
Joined
Jan 8, 2009
Messages
10,350
Holy shit, now that might help me get back into this. So it actually erases entire star systems?
 
Joined
Mar 3, 2010
Messages
8,820
Location
Italy
i've been playing with this mod since ever, but the game slows down to a crawl before i can reach these technologies.
 

Gepeu

Savant
Patron
Joined
Oct 16, 2016
Messages
986
Is there anything that could help me avoid the LAG during bigger galaxies sessions?
 

a cut of domestic sheep prime

Guest
Holy shit, now that might help me get back into this. So it actually erases entire star systems?
Effectiely, though not actually. What it does is it turn all of the worlds barren and changes the star type to a pulsar-looking thing, I guess. Kind of a hack, but those worlds are dead and not coming back. Looks like it also kills all the ships in the system, though I haven't actually used it yet.
i've been playing with this mod since ever, but the game slows down to a crawl before i can reach these technologies.
That's the one problem with them. They are so high-tier as to make it very late-game only. Just to have the funds to build some of them you'd need to control half the galaxy, and for the fleet-killer ship, you need to have it "eat" 40 enemy planets before it's at full power. Plus, they are all rare techs.

I would recommend using the full version of the mod because at that late a stage in vanilla Stellaris, you just don't need any ships with that kind of firepower.
 
Last edited by a moderator:
Joined
Jan 7, 2012
Messages
14,153
Is there anything that could help me avoid the LAG during bigger galaxies sessions?

I think lots of small empires makes worse lag than a few big ones, so starting with fewer would help. Also helps the AI, since it doesn't aggressively expand well.

But lag IS guaranteed eventually at 400 or higher star galaxies.
 

Space Satan

Arcane
Vatnik
Joined
May 13, 2013
Messages
6,216
Location
Space Hell
Hello everyone and welcome to another Stellaris development diary. Today's dev diary is going to be about a few different features coming in the Utopia expansion and associated Banks update: Native Indoctrination, Unrest and Faction Interactions.

Native Indoctrination (Paid Feature)
Anyone who's ever accidentally enlightened Fanatic Purifiers should be well familiar with the perils of not checking the ethics of a primitive civilization before deciding to enlighten or infiltrate them. In Utopia, we've added a new tool for players to interfere with primitive civilizations: Indoctrination. Indoctrination is a new observation station mission that allows you to 'educate' primitives in your clearly superior way of thinking. While active, it will greatly increase the attraction of your Governing Ethics for the Pops on the primitive planet, and cause them to drift towards those ethics over time. As the Pops start changing ethics, the Governing Ethics of the primitive ciivlization will change along with them, and you will be notified that your mission is making progress. Given enough time to do its job, this mission will eventually cause the primitive civilization's ethics to precisely mirror your own. The Indoctrination mission requires the Active Native Interference policy and so will be available to all ethics.
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Unrest (Free Feature)
Back in Dev Diary #54 we talked about the ethics and faction rework, and mentioned that details on how rebel factions work would come later. After some testing and iteration, we ended up deciding that the new faction system didn't really fit the old rebel style of faction, and consequently separated it into its own system called Unrest. Each planet has an Unrest value from 0 to 100 determined by local conditions and, sometimes, empire-wide effects. Unrest is primarily increased by unhappy Pops and decreased by happy Pops and the presence of garrisoned armies. Free Pops, happy or not, will have a higher effect on Unrest than enslaved ones, representing their ability to better organize against their 'oppressors'.

Unrest has directly detrimental effects on the planet's ability to produce resources, and can also result in a number of different events depending on the severity on the situation. The effects of such events are primarily political, with your population turning towards a particular ethic or against a government that is unable to protect it from violence and terrorism. However, Unrest can also turn more serious when it is coupled with the presence of a particularly discontent or oppressed group, such as an enslaved underclass or a nationalist movement. When such a group begins to organize, you will get an event warning you of the situation that gives you some time to try and get the Unrest under control. If you fail to do so, the situation will escalate, resulting in events of increasing severity such as hunger strikes, riots, and possibly even a full-blown armed revolt.
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Faction Interactions (Free Feature)
Also mentioned in Dev Diary #54 was the ability to use Factions to shift your Governing Ethics. The new Faction Interaction system allows you to both influence which Ethics will take root in your empire, as well as change your Governing Ethics when a particular Ethic grows strong enough. Each Ethic has at least one associated faction, such as the Supremacist Faction for Xenophobes, and by promoting or suppressing that faction you can spend a monthly influence cost to increase or decrease the attraction of its associated Ethic across your empire. If a faction grows strong enough, you can also Embrace that faction, shifting your Governing Ethics to more closely align with theirs.

In most cases, shifting your Governing Ethics will involve moving a single step towards that ethic, for example moving from Xenophobe to Fanatic Xenophobe or from Fanatic Xenophile to Xenophile if shifting towards Xenophobe. As this will typically result in having too many or too few Governing Ethics, it will also automatically adjust your other ethics to follow the 3 ethics points rule, downgrading, upgrading, removing or adding ethics as necessary. Which ethic is lost or added is determined by attraction, so if you are Spiritualist, Xenophobe and Authoritarian and make a shift towards Militarist, whichever of Spiritualist, Xenophobe and Authoritarian has the lowest attraction in your empire will be lost as a Governing Ethic.
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That's all for today! Next week we'll be talking about the last of the major feature reworks coming in Banks: Government and Civics.

We'll also be talking about Hive Minds.
 

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