Wake me up when the Incline begins...

[Outlander]

If by "incline" you mean to relive your childhood experiences while playing the classics, it'll never happen again.

That was meant to happen at a certain time, when the gaming industry wasn't the pile of dung it is today and devs put effort in creative content instead of shiny superficial layers, and us young lads at the time being able to appreciate that. That's done, we'll never 'feel' the same again. Chocolate cake may blow your mind the first time you taste it, but after a few years eating it, yeah you still like it but you sort of get used to it.

Pick any random kid today and make him play Darklands or Wasteland 1: 'lel there's no way I'm playing that old shit!' *goes back to Skyrim*

Of course for us in our 30s there are a few exceptions to the rule like Underrail and AoD, if those games had been released in the 90s I'm sure today they'd be heralded as lauded RPG classics right alongside Fallout and Baldur's Gate, but not today. So I don't think we'll see any other 'mindblowing' RPG ever again. And the problem isn't with the games themselves (talking about AoD, Underrail, D:OS), but with us and how the industry shaped the current video gaming state.

 

[makiavelli747]

I'm not terribly impressed by someone's ability to script different ending slides. The reactivity I care about is being able to interact with the game world and have it react to what I do

In other words u r a graphics whore. Arcanum had the same game ending slides, by the way, and it didn't react to shit of what you do.

and come up with it myself,

Good god, you were smart enough to cheat the broken system.

 

[Lurker King]

We had to ban it from fidonet ru.game.rpg just to keep the retards out, ffs.

:D

 

[mondblut]

We had to ban it from fidonet ru.game.rpg just to keep the retards out, ffs.

:D

What shocked you so much? Fido was russistan's primary network until well into 2k00s. Unlimited dialup internet access cost up to 150$ per month in around 1998, ffs (with average monthly salary being about the same). This is third world we are speaking about, mind you.

 

[mondblut]

I'm not terribly impressed by someone's ability to script different ending slides. The reactivity I care about is being able to interact with the game world and have it react to what I do

In other words u r a graphics whore. Arcanum had the same game ending slides, by the way, and it didn't react to shit of what you do.

I am not a big fan of Arcanum, but at least it had a somewhat functional game attached to its CYOA visual novel.

Good god, you were smart enough to cheat the broken system.

That's what RPGs are about, duh.

 

[Lurker King]

Also AoD doesn't really have a game world to speak about. It's a collection of set pieces and you're being teleported between them.

What you fail to see with this mindset is that the set pieces are countless, believable and much more interesting than four ways to steal stuff from the same dude. The game offers you more choices, but you think they are not choices because teleports.

Yeah, well, I've only seen you claim VD is the best game designer and writer in existence, if that's game design discussion then so is "AoD is complete and utter crap and VD sucks at writing".

He is not and his team is not. How could they? This was the first game! I’m sure the more seasoned developers could implement their ideas with better interface, faster, etc. Their merits is that they have the balls to ignore common prejudices about cRPGs and stick to their vision until the end instead of scaling down, like most developers do. In case you haven’t’ noticed, most developers nowadays are either popamoles or sellouts. ITS can be many things, sellouts they aren’t.

 

[Lurker King]

Shadowruns (at least the second part - the only one i played) was incline. Not as in - "it is a timeless classic" - incline but as in "a turn-based, party based crpg with an ok-ish story/setting" - incline.

The combat system is as shallow as you get and the main story is retarded. The setting would be great if they knew how to profit from it. The game is an iPhone game for fuck’s sake. I played the games because I was foolish enough to take some people here seriously and was bored to death. If you said that the developers had what it takes to make a decent game, I would believe you. But that doesn’t matter because they just want to make a buck.

I am not a big fan of Arcanum, but at least it had a somewhat functional game attached to its CYOA visual novel.

So Arcanum has better gamaplay than AoD? OH MY GOD, I’m not reading this. So let me ask you this. If instead of teleporting between different scenes you just had to walk, the game would not be a CYOA anymore?

 

[octavius]

I am not sold on the nostalgia argument, I think if a game is special you appreciate it regardless, I was there and played Deus Ex, Gothic, PST, BG etc when they came out and had a great time, somehow VTMB went under my radar and I ended up playing it for the first time 10 years after it came out, despite being older/more cynical/whatever I had a fantastic time with it and put me into that sort of ''gaming trance'' where you are immersed and fascinated by all the details, the lore, the setting, etc.

I agree; I had similar experiences with ancients games like Magic Candle, Wizardry 1-5, Dark Heart of Uukrul, which I played first when I was in my forties. Some of my favourite games from the golden age around 2000 (like BG and Deus Ex) I also played first when I was many years past the formative years.
I haven't played any of the new games, though, so I can't compare them to the games of the golden ages.

 

[makiavelli747]

I am not a big fan of Arcanum, but at least it had a somewhat functional game attached to its CYOA visual novel.

CYOA... visual novel... I bet you stupid old fuck don't even understand what is that means. I am a fan of Troika's games, and I'm asking you what kind of 'functional game' Arcanum had? Lore? Useless skills? Retarded difficulty of combat and everything else?

That's what RPGs are about, duh

That's what morons are all about. You fucks should try to make your own game one day, and maybe after everybody shit on it you'll think about a thing called game design. Maybe then you'll think about options you can provide to a player in certain quests and ways to present them. Maybe then you'll see the difference between fake choices a.k.a. 10 ways or dialogue lines to get the same respond/result, etc.

 

[mondblut]

So Arcanum has better gamaplay than AoD? OH MY GOD, I’m not reading this.

Dunno, haven't played AoD. Zero interest in teleporting from one dialogue tree into another.

So let me ask you this. If instead of teleporting between different scenes you just had to walk, the game would not be a CYOA anymore?

It would certainly be more of an RPG. You can't have exploration and adventuring without fucking travel.

 

[makiavelli747]

. You can't have exploration and adventuring without fucking travel.

So instead of meaningful encounters you need walking simulator. Big congrats, TES fag.

 

[toro]

I don't know about AOD. I cannot into teleportation.

But Underrail is the first "classic" in years. It's isometric, has great TB combat, has a good story, has a great perks system, has unique systems (for ex: oddities) and it's above everything else that was released in the last years (more specific since 2010 when F3:NV was released).

 

[mondblut]

. You can't have exploration and adventuring without fucking travel.

So instead of meaningful encounters you need walking simulator. Big congrats, TES fag.

Walking simulators >>>>>>> visual novels, My Little Pony Romance: The Manga fag.

 

[OSK]

There are people here lamenting that the incline wasn't us re-climbing the majestic mountains of yore, when they should be appreciating that we just crawled out of a seemingly bottomless pit of despair. Incline is incline. And we inclined.

 

[makiavelli747]

Walking simulators >>>>>>> visual novels

If only you knew what is visual novel... but, whatever... morons are morons

 

[Joevonzombie]

Undertale is one of the most overrated games in recent memory.

 

[an Administrator]

. You can't have exploration and adventuring without fucking travel.

So instead of meaningful encounters you need walking simulator. Big congrats, TES fag.

That's a shitty argument. Having basic exploration in an RPG is a necessity. Walking sims are more interesting than teleport sims.

 

[makiavelli747]

That's a shitty argument. Having basic exploration in an RPG is a necessity. Walking sims are more interesting than teleport sims

It seems like you are a bunch of epic heroes. Who am I to argue with you guys...

 

[Skittles]

Undertale is one of the most overrated games in recent memory.

https://af.gog.com/game/underrail?as=1649904300

 

[Joevonzombie]

Undertale is one of the most overrated games in recent memory.

https://af.gog.com/game/underrail?as=1649904300

OP mentioned both games in the original post

 

[Lurker King]

Dunno, haven't played AoD. Zero interest in teleporting from one dialogue tree into another. (...) You can't have exploration and adventuring without fucking travel.

So you basically have no idea what you are talking about. The few teleports in the game are optional, you have lots of exploration, things to do and lots of walking around. I guess that even text-adventures must be also teleport, but hey, that it is just VD's game, a fucking nobody. Let's just talk trash to show how much we despise him instead of actually knowing the basics of the subject.

That's a shitty argument. Having basic exploration in an RPG is a necessity. Walking sims are more interesting than teleport sims.

Of course it is, you fucking retarded. The question is whether the definition of exploration should be restricted to walking around in gigantic maps or can be something more, including text-adventures and scripted events.

But Underrail is the first "classic" in years. It's isometric, has great TB combat, has a good story, has a great perks system, has unique systems (for ex: oddities) and it's above everything else that was released in the last years (more specific since 2010 when F3:NV was released).

It's mostly linear, grinding as fuck, has overpowered broken builds, retarded MMO design (cooldowns, idiotic enemies respawning all the time), retarded writing, fedex quests.

 

[Invictus]

There are people here lamenting that the incline wasn't us re-climbing the majestic mountains of yore, when they should be appreciating that we just crawled out of a seemingly bottomless pit of despair. Incline is incline. And we inclined.

You know what? You are right; while there have been no "timeless classics" in the last 5 years there HAS been Incline with some pretty good games and we have way more quality releases now with some pretty promising stuff like Battle Brothers, VDs Colony ship game, Torment, Bard's Tale 4 etc
Perhaps I was too hasty because a big rainbow filled Incline never materialized but we are way better off now

 

[IncendiaryDevice]

There are people here lamenting that the incline wasn't us re-climbing the majestic mountains of yore, when they should be appreciating that we just crawled out of a seemingly bottomless pit of despair. Incline is incline. And we inclined.

You know what? You are right; while there have been no "timeless classics" in the last 5 years there HAS been Incline with some pretty good games and we have way more quality releases now with some pretty promising stuff like Battle Brothers, VDs Colony ship game, Torment, Bard's Tale 4 etc
Perhaps I was too hasty because a big rainbow filled Incline never materialized but we are way better off now

I know exactly what you mean, and, like many others, I agree it has bugger all to do with nostalgia. The correct term/phrase IMO for the current incline is "frustratingly close but just not quite nailing it", and its more a case of the frustration clouding the incline like a fog than there not being an incline.

My personal case in point would be Serpent in the Staglands. I really enjoyed playing this one... for the most part. It was a case of forgiving the negative aspects because, jesus christ, at least it was something, something that was oh so close to that thing that's so good. But it didn't feel completely whole, not a 100% product, and this is the impression I get when reading about the kickstarters I haven't played yet.

It's very difficult to put into words the exact emotion they garner, the sense that there's just this one vital component that's missing, sort of the same difference between Divine Divinity and Beyond Divinity, one just had it in spades whereas the other was just not quite right, but god help you if you wanted to explain why without imploding into a 10 page micro-analysis that loses itself after page 2.

 

[anvi]

DoS was the only good one, and even that could be better. But DoS 2 looks like it will be.

 

[Siobhan]

I agree; I had similar experiences with ancients games like Magic Candle, Wizardry 1-5, Dark Heart of Uukrul, which I played first when I was in my forties.

I agree with the sentiment but can't resist playing devil's advocate: nostalgia may nonetheless be a factor insofar as old games are necessarily old-school and thus exhibit traces of the kind of video game design that shaped your formative gaming years and hence your expectations of what games should be like. I didn't play Anvil of Dawn until recently, but the fact that it mirrored a lot of the real-time blobbers I played in the early 90s definitely elevated my enjoyment beyond what the game could provide purely on its own merits. It also got bonus points for the mere fact that it didn't have any of the minor things I dislike about modern games by virtue of not being used to them (e.g. Apple UI design). To put it differently: if you grew up watching old black&white movies with your grandma who has now passed away, watching any old black&white movie will have a nostalgic component no matter whether you've seen it before.

That said, anybody who plays the nostalgia card when discussing a game is a massive retard that doesn't understand the point of debate.