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Nevill

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Shadorwun: Hong Kong
What's with all this talk about poisons? I thought Codex didn't want Jing to be a dirty poisoner.
We are considering marrying Jing into the whole community of poisoners. It's not like he even has to do it himself if he chooses to. All it would take is a hint to Qilin and a rationalization why it would help Wudu goals.

It is not like the 'Dex wanted to become married at an age of 17-18, either. One must adapt to the new plot developments. I am just checking if it opens up certain possibilities to take a shortcut here and there.
 

Baltika9

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Ah well, too bad we won't be meeting our four-armed tiger-demon brethren.

As for poisons and doping, well, since we're already getting closely involved with the Wudu, might as well. Jing's hands aren't clean as it is, and it's more merciful to be killing a guy with a sweet, painless poison than ripping off his arm and beating him to death with it, or just smashing his spine in and leaving him to choke on his own blood.

I'm just curious: if the toad demon's essence gives us poison resistance, shouldn't that also extend to doping?
And completely off topic: is it possible to brew mutagens a-la TWitcher with sufficient herbalism skills?
 

Nevill

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Shadorwun: Hong Kong
Re: poisons.
I can see that the adjutant is being turned into a rogue, though. Still won't be as good as the real deal, the lack of sleight-of-hand cuts out many crafty options. The high stealth and lethal combat potential makes him suitable for assassination missions against soft targets, so that's one job he can excel at.
I am very interested in those 'crafty' options to combat enemies that outclass us, since we are closing that gap.
Jing is not a novice to psychological warfare (matches with Yifang and Nie Mudan come to mind), and I hope to develop this aspect. Poisons, laxatives, fiddling with their shoe laces and cutting their pants off - as long as it throws them off their game, its all good.
 

treave

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Codex 2012
Probably premature to assume that a marriage is on the cards in the immediate future, but I have no idea why anyone would want to take an about-turn on the character's personality and make him a strong advocate of poisoning his foes in the jianghu regardless of whether or not he is married into the Wudu Cult. Doing it for political purposes is fine, but that doesn't mean he'll want to do it to people he should actually be fighting and testing himself against. Takes all the fun out of a fight for the guy.

As for doping-resistance, if you are resistant to the negative effects of the dope it won't give you the positive effects either. Which makes it utterly pointless.

And no mutagens.

Re: poisons.

I am very interested in those 'crafty' options to combat enemies that outclass us, since we are closing that gap.
Jing is not a novice to psychological warfare (matches with Yifang and Nie Mudan come to mind), and I hope to develop this aspect. Poisons, laxatives, fiddling with their shoe laces and cutting their pants off - as long as it throws them off their game, its all good.

The crafty options out of combat may involve things like stealing important information, drugging tea and wine, etc. It's the 'win before you fight' strategy, which will not be used all the time because the character doesn't approach each fight like it's some serious, must-win-at-all-costs duel. In combat, sleight-of-hand will help with trickery like feints and misdirections e.g. Deceptive Fish Stab will be improved, you do things like vanishing small weapons or being able to pickpocket from the enemy in battle without them realizing it more easily.
 
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ERYFKRAD

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Strap Yourselves In Serpent in the Staglands Shadorwun: Hong Kong Pillars of Eternity 2: Deadfire Steve gets a Kidney but I don't even get a tag. Pathfinder: Wrath I'm very into cock and ball torture I helped put crap in Monomyth
I'm not a fan of using poisons either, being tricky is one thing, poisons is far beyond the point where tricky ends and sneaksie scumses begins.
 

Baltika9

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Just wondering, is all.
but I have no idea why anyone would want to take an about-turn on the character's personality and make him a strong advocate of poisoning his foes in the jianghu regardless of whether or not he is married into the Wudu Cult.
Wasn't implying that, just saying that when it comes down to actual planned killing and politics, I see no reason why we shouldn't use poisons if the situation is right. Jing is by no means a saint.

As for getting hitched to Qilin, or anyone else for that matter, we ought to complete LORD Zhang's challenge and the second stage of his training first, unless we want to leave widows and bastards behind us. That being said, the Wudu like us, Qilin really likes Jing, Jing likes Qilin, so why not?
 

Rex Feral

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I'm not against poisons myself, but using them in a tournament against fellow pugilists? It's more important to be fair and have integrity than to win at any cost, especially at a fucking game.

Now if it were an assassination, fight to the death or we'd have to save a friend then sure, we could use anything that goes. But not in a tournament, where some of our opponents will be friends or future friends.

Besides if we use poisons and tricks(excessively) to win fights, we will begin to use them as a crutch, and will never improve.

In my opinion we should never use poison in a tournament fight and use tricks only as a last resort.
 

Nevill

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Shadorwun: Hong Kong
Probably premature to assume that a marriage is on the cards in the immediate future,
In about two to three months Qilin will know if she is pregnant or not. In about six months she would not be able to hide it even if she wanted to. Her family would have to act to have us take responsibility by then.

Six months does sound like an immediate future.

Rex Feral said:
I'm not against poisons myself, but using them in a tournament against fellow pugilists? It's more important to be fair and have integrity than to win at any cost, especially at a fucking game.
Depends on the kind of poison, I suppose. Laxatives are as close to food poisoning as it can get, and still their use is considered nothing more than a prank.

Rex Feral said:
In my opinion we should never use poison in a tournament fight and use tricks only as a last resort.
You did not like how we lololed our way to the title of the champion in the Young Tiger Tournament? I'd say it was a success, all things considered.
 
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Baltika9

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I'm not against poisons myself, but using them in a tournament against fellow pugilists? It's more important to be fair and have integrity than to win at any cost, especially at a fucking game.
:lol:
Indeed, Jing is the incarnation of HONOR and FAIRNESS! Better watch out, BJ, we're about to steal win your title of Gentleman in an honorable and clean duel of swords, and just swords. Pure skill and finesse, no dirty tricks from us.
 
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Nevill

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Shadorwun: Hong Kong
Indeed, Jing is the incarnation of HONOR and FAIRNESS! Better watch out, BJ, we're about to steal win your title of Gentleman in an honorable and clean duel of swords, and just swords. Pure skill amd finesse, no dirty tricks from us.
With only the Pine-Cutting technique. The other one has a word 'deceptive' in it.
 

treave

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Codex 2012
Probably premature to assume that a marriage is on the cards in the immediate future,
In about two to three months Qilin will know if she is pregnant or not. In about six months she would not be able to hide it even if she wanted to. Her family would have to act to have us take responsibility by then.

Six months does sound like an immediate future.

That is if she does get pregnant and decides to keep it. Cao'er knows plenty of safe abortifacients, and it isn't really much of a taboo for them. If you are willing to take responsibility, great. If you are not yet ready, her family need never find out, if that is what she wishes.

Again, as I said, it is premature to assume that marriage is definitely going to happen in the immediate future. She might even die in a couple of updates, for all you know. You don't know what is going to happen.
 

Baltika9

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Again, as I said, it is premature to assume that marriage is definitely going to happen in the immediate future. She might even die in a couple of updates, for all you know. You don't know what is going to happen.
Ah shit, then we'll have to travel the underworld, search for a water dragon, do a long-ass complicated quest to bring her back to life...

Should've stayed an emotionally confused homosexual.
 

Nevill

Arcane
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Shadorwun: Hong Kong
That is if she does get pregnant and decides to keep it. Cao'er knows plenty of safe abortifacients, and it isn't really much of a taboo for them. If you are willing to take responsibility, great. If you are not yet ready, her family need never find out, if that is what she wishes.
Of course it only concerns us if she gets pregnant. As for keeping it... the whole reason why it happened the way it happened was that she wanted to receive something from us. I just can't imagine an abortion with a mindset like that. We could persuade her to do it, but, man, would that be disgusting to break the girl like this.

She might even die in a couple of updates, for all you know. You don't know what is going to happen.
Well, we might get killed in a couple of updates. We can't foresee accidents. It does not mean that planning for the future is a useless waste of time.

Baltika9 said:
Ah shit, then we'll have to travel the underworld, search for a water dragon, do a long-ass complicated quest to bring her back to life...
Would totally do it, too.
 
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treave

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Codex 2012
Well, we might get killed in a couple of updates. We can't foresee accidents. It does not mean that planning for the future is a useless waste of time.

It's the sort of thing that should more suitably be discussed before you take the plunge and bang the girl, or later if/when a marriage option comes up. I mean, I don't want to stop anyone from speculating, but I just feel it's somewhat of a waste to plan that far before you get the relevant details.
 

Baltika9

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:lol:
True, we YOLOTIGER'd our way into her vagina, and we'll YOLOTIGER our way into marrying her, or not. That's the cool thing about being a young YOLOTIGER: you do what you want and what feels right, and survive the consequences, which either forge you into a bad motherfucker or get you killed. Either way, fuck it, YOLO.

And all of this pointless speculation is here because we don't have an update to obssess over.
 

Nevill

Arcane
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Messages
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Shadorwun: Hong Kong
Yeah, if the marriage is too far in the future to make assumptions, we can start speculating about the demands Cao'er is about to make. Those should be fun.

Maybe after she is done with us we won't have to worry about the marriage at all.
 

treave

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Codex 2012
Black Tiger Valley

On your way back to your quarters, you see Gao Ying in front of you. “I am surprised. I thought you would have accepted His Majesty’s offer,” he says. You raise your shoulders in a shrug. “Still haven’t gotten in to filling in that hole, eunuch?”

Gao Ying replies, “Soon. The engineers need to be mobilized for some reconstruction… I cannot do it with my bare hands after all. It is a good thing I have plenty of free time now that the secret police are being disbanded.”

“Ha! I know him well enough, eunuch,” you laugh. “I am not as smart as Shun or Yu, but I am not so stupid that I do not realize the stratagem of feigning foolishness while keeping your wits when I see it. It was telling when he did not offer you any position in the new constabulary.”

“His Majesty just might not trust me enough to grant me any positions of power,” demurs Gao Ying.

“And again, I said I know him well enough. A virtue of a great ruler is in how he employs men,” you reply. “First make them believe he is an idealistic fool, then let them see the cracks in his camp. How are the preparations going?”

Gao Ying smiles. “Perfectly. Of course, Grand Eunuch Li is suspicious and smart enough to see through the ploy, if there was one.”

“Which would set him up for the second ploy, hidden behind the first. Let your enemies know your next move,” you recite, recalling the treatises you once studied with Shun. You are sure Xiahou Yu knows them well too. “What would that be, the diffusion of your spies and informants in a network now free from secret police control?”

“I am not at liberty to say, Xu Jing,” says Gao Ying, still smiling.

“It doesn’t sound like it is going to be easy. I suspect that the Grand Eunuch will be starting to think two moves ahead, after that little show we put on.”

“Which merely means we will have to be three moves ahead.”

You walk past the eunuch, smiling. “Well then,” you respond, “the warrior will leave the handling of the emperor’s political foes to the scholar and the eunuch.”

“A good decision. Your fight for His Majesty’s continued success will be in other arenas,” comes Gao Ying’s reply from behind you.

“By the way,” you pause and ask, “why did you try to save me from falling?”

“Why, indeed.” He lets out a little chuckle, and begins to walk away from you. “His Majesty passed me a message before the mission began. That is all I will say. I am not yet convinced your influence on His Majesty is the wisest thing to keep around, but for now we are on the same side. Aren’t we?” His footsteps stop.

“Yes. We are,” you answer, and continue on your way without looking back.

***

By the fifth day, you knew you were never going to make it in time to Heihu Valley. On the seventh, still a day away from reaching the site of the challenge, you came across two panicked beggars.

The news was not good. The Fire Temple had been more powerful than the Eight Sects expected. The battle between the Lord of the Temple and the Grand Taoist had drawn in another six heads of the Eight Sects, as well as five of the deadly Amesha Spenta warriors. A cliff had been brought down by the battle, and the combatants’ fate unknown, presumed dead: the beggars were running to send out the word to everyone about the result of the challenge.

For now, the Fire Cult’s contingent was retreating as the outcome had been beyond their expectations too, and the remaining orthodox fighters have rallied together under Bai Jiutian to pursue the cultists.

***

The top of the hill provides you a good vantage point from which you can observe the battle going on below. The orthodox pugilists had caught up with the Fire Cultists, and the fracas had devolved into a melee soon enough. “…I think I can get a better view if we climb up there, Jing,” says Cao’er, tugging at your sleeve as she points to the highest tree on the hill top. Seeing her, you can’t help but redden slightly, remembering what she said to you back in the palace: “…I want the first time to come more naturally… so I’ll wait. It will be more… memorable. When you are ready, Jing.”

You are pretty sure Qilin had something to do with those strange words. You think the two of them are planning something, but you don't know what yet...

Without asking for permission, Cao’er leaps up and sits on your shoulders, her long legs swinging gently on either side of your face. “Come on. Climb,” she orders. “Don’t fall now,” waves Qilin, laughing as she sits under the tree, seemingly unconcerned with the battle raging below.

***

At the top, it seems clear that the orthodox pugilists heavily outnumber the Fire Cultists. Cao’er manages to spot several people known to you engaged in battle. You wonder if you should join in any particular fight…

***

A. Yunzi is fighting the Huashan Twins, and the flow of the fight appears rather even, with no side able to gain the advantage over the other for now.

B. Bai Jiutian is engaged with Vahista, and surprisingly holding his own, though the spokesperson of the Amesha Spenta appears to be gradually gaining the upper hand.

C. Guo Fu is cut off from his Wudang brothers, surrounded by more than fifty Fire Cult fighters and holding them off single-handedly. You do not know how long he can last.

D. A group of Taishan and Kunlun disciples are easily beating back some junior Fire Cult fighters – it looks like there may be some deaths involved soon.

1. You join the side of the orthodox pugilists.
2. You join the side of the Fire Cult.
3. You attack both sides, attempting to force them to stop their fight.

E. You stay out of it, preferring to just stand by and watch, waiting for the fights to resolve themselves and for matters to become less messy before you jump in.

***

When you come down from the tree, you see a surprising sight, putting your plans to join the fray on hold. “Guess who’s here?” says Qilin, turning to you.

“What are you doing here, Brother Xu?” Murong Yandi gives you a pleased smile as he greets you. “That should be my question! How have you been?” You give him the traditional salute, open hand over closed fist.

“I’m doing well, thank you. I assume you came for the challenge?” he asks.

“Yes, but it seems that we are too late.”

Murong Yandi nods sadly. “I suppose so. My master hurried for no reason.”

“You mean… the Sword Saint is here?”

Murong Yandi jerks his head over his shoulder, drawing your sight to the man standing behind him. The Sword Saint is watching the battle below, his hands folded behind him. He is younger than your master, an unkempt, rather bookish fellow with long hair left untied, falling down to his shoulders. His expression is mild and appears to be lost in daydreams, though some would call it serene. A large, black sword is strapped to his back: the legendary Zhanlu Sword.

“Master, this is the Man Tiger Pig, Xu Jing,” calls out Murong Yandi. The greatest swordsman in the world turns around, his eyes half-closed, and says, “Hm?”

“Do you remember that I told you about him? The Southern Maniac’s disciple?”

He seems to become slightly more alert at the mention of your master. “Ah, Jue’s only surviving apprentice? I have heard of you. How fares your master?” he says lazily.

“I think he should be doing well, though last I heard he had sailed for Nippon,” you say politely.

“That must be terrible,” he says with a straight face. “Well, in any case, he is not one to miss a fight. I am surprised he isn’t here yet, but he should be soon.”

You are not sure whether that prediction is a good or bad thing.

“So, Master Shangguan,” you ask, “are you planning on participating in the fight?”

“I am yet undecided,” says the Sword Saint simply. “On one hand, the Fire Cult may be dangerous to the country, but on the other hand, I am not too sure if it is the righteous thing to do, to cut them down like this. Mercy to the defeated is the prerogative of the strong, after all. What do you think I should do, Yandi?”

“You should attack both sides,” says Murong Yandi without hesitating. “With your strength, it would be possible to force them to stop fighting.”

“Sounds like a bother,” laughs the Sword Saint, before turning to you, Qilin and Cao’er. “And what do you think I should do?”

“…up to Jing…” mutters Cao’er as she looks away from the man, while Qilin just shakes her head. “I’m just along because someone would be utterly incapable without my presence,” she grins.

You have already decided on what you would do, but what do you think the Sword Saint should do?

***

A. You ask for him to intervene in the fight; you are interested in his strength, and he could be helpful.

B. You don’t ask for him to intervene in the fight, preferring that he stay out of the battle.
 
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Baltika9

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:lol:
Oh man, the Sword Saint is a funny guy: "Sounds like a bother." :lol:

As the sole disciple of our Master, it is our sacred duty to go X3. However, we did come here for Yunzi, and her guys are getting overpowered. Damn, we missed out on getting closer to them two times already. Let's not do it a third time.

D2- this will win the most respect from the Cult and Yunzi is doing fine on her own right now, no need to go whiteknighting her, she's a strong and skilled girl.
A- since we're supporting the underdogs, having as much firepower as possible is a must. Yandi was itching to get his hands on BJ, too.
 
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Nevill

Arcane
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Messages
11,211
Shadorwun: Hong Kong
I am very tempted to attack both sides, since we want to battle the orthodoxes, but we kind of want not to be proclaimed the race traitors, too. But
Yandi said:
“With your strength, it would be possible.”
we are not the Sword Saint.

Baltika9 said:
However, we did come here for Yunzi, and her guys are getting overpowered.
If we stop the fight, it will help them, too.
 
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treave

Arcane
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Codex 2012
This vote will be counted in a block for both choices. Your first choice will be related to the consequences of the second choice.

The stance in the first choice only relates to that particular fight, you're not expected to fight the entire field. You aren't the Sword Saint, after all. :lol:
 

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